Bible Discussion Replies PAGE 1285

Indeed Jim. Jesus was known as both the Son of God & the Son of Man - He definitely was a Man in every respect, bar the sin nature.

You wrote: "Jesus was exalted by God. If he was exalted it must mean he was lower in position." And again, yes, He was found in that lower position as a man, which Hebrews 2:9 speaks of: "But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man." And in His Coming, "HE TOOK NOT ON HIM the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham." (v16). Why should it be said of Him that He should take on man's flesh (seed of Abraham), when the possibility was there that He take on the nature "like unto the angels"? Apart from the obvious fact that He needed to become a Man for being the sacrifice for our sins, the other matter that is evident in that verse, is that He had the Power to assume any substance or material He wished. So Who then is this Man Jesus? Is He not the One Who also said, "Before Abraham was (or, existed), I am" ( John 8:58)? And He also said, "O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I HAD WITH THEE before the world was." ( John 17:5).

The question therefore remains: where was Jesus before He became a Man & before He "MADE HIMSELF of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross." ( Philippians 2:8,9)? If He only began life as a Man of God/God's Appointed, how do we answer these other Scriptures that speak of another Life before His Birth? And His clear claims to a pre-existence in Heaven? Can we force another meaning to any of them?

To Jim. The thread is huge and this is a short reply.

1. The word TRINITY is not in the King James Bible.

2. I do not debate on this issue. I know Trinity appears in other Bible versions too.

3. I'm not going to change my mind.

4. I'm against issues__that "divide" people in this comment forum. May we be in agreement and United through the Holy Spirit.

Rather than trying to convert others, it's better that God the Father, Jesus and the Holy Spirit to be Praised and Worshipped.

Anything that divides us, is subject to scrutiny, because of Matthew 25:33

Sheep are followers, and goats say "bah" or BUT.

I just choose to be at peace and let the Lord sort this out.

May The Lord tell us what is Truth.

Mishael

Just about anyone on this site, mostly we're volunteering. Do you have any biblical questions, you want scripture for?

Thank you, I was thinking maybe it was something else, I appreciate you taking time to answer my question. Remember the only dumb question is one your afraid to ask. (Good to know it was pretty much soup) and nothing perverse.

Hi Jim

I understand your point.

I did give you Scripture to support my view.

As to going outside Scripture to Prove my point, please be aware that anytime you chose to listen to a pastor preach in an expository way (we're he gives his explanation) or you read anything published from a favorite Christian author who explains Scripture, or on this site when you or anyone else explains their thinking about a Scripture verse, one is "going outside Scripture"

If one only gives Scriptire verses on here without interpretation, then it is only Scripture speaking.

No where in Scripture does it say we are to reject any words that are not direct Scripture quotes. We need to be open to be taught by others and there is 2000 years of Christian writings for us to consider prayerfully holding them up to Scripture as the Bereans did.

I for one have been immensely helped by reading commentary and expositions on Scriptures and doctrines. Paul told us to

Pursue sound doctrine, yet he did not lay out a set of systematic doctrines in his letters. But he did say that churches should have pastors, elders , and teachers to teach believers the doctrines of the common faith. Those doctrines have been preserved and expounded on over the centuries.

Some people do not wish to listen To any of these voices of faith. Some people bristle at the term "doctrine" and "orthodox". To me this shows a resistance to learn outside of one's own interpretation or that of the "groups" they hang with. To me, it also shows an arrogance and a prejudice against persons of faith over the centuries, thinking somehow that there was a "truth gap" between the apostolic times and today. That is a short sighted and naive view, in my opinion as well as a lack of faith in Jesus who said that He would build and preserve his church in all ages. But each of us decides for ourselves whom we listen to and learn from.

I believe the Holy Spirit does guide us, but that does not mean that each person is the sole interpreter

Leviticus 13:45, Leviticus 14:2-3,32, Leviticus 14, most of the chapter discusses the law of strictness, sacrifice, isolation, cleansing, hinting the severity. Leviticus 22:4, Numbers 5:1,2, Matthew 8:2-4, Mark 1:40-44, Luke 17:11-19,

2 Kings 5:1-14, note 2 Kings 5:15-27, Luke 4:14-27,

2 Kings 7:3-11, (the whole story started previous chapter/s & continues after verses I noted)

2 Kings 15:5, 2 Chronicles 26:21,23,

Matthew 10:1-8, Matthew 11:1-5,

Mark 3:1-5, Luke 14:1-4,

Hopefully these scriptures help in your study

Dr. Lee I said the law was completed which made available grace, it is written Grace And truth came With Christ!

Remembered another one._ James 4:17, hopefully this helps.

I 1st thought of the scripture Adam & Spencer Shaw gave you. Then I prayed I might understand what you're looking for.

Hebrews 10:26-39

I searched under wisdom & found these. Hopefully these are helpful in what you're looking for: I added a few additional.

Matthew 12:41-42, Luke 11:31-32, Luke 11:52, Ecclesiastes 10:1, James 3:13-18,

Ecclesiastes 1:18, Proverbs 17:16,

Job 11:6-7, Job 26:1-4, Job 28:28,

Psalms 37:27-31, Psalms 111:10, Proverbs 10,

Most verses on wisdom are how good & pleasant it is: Proverbs 19:8, Proverbs 23:4, Ecclesiastes 7:12,

please explain what it means to seek the Lords face when I have never seen his face because I do not believe that the of Jesus are true please help me to under stand thank you and God bless

I will comment of versus 1-5, the first day of creation, God created a single heaven known as the second heaven where the sun, moon and stars would dwell on the fourth day. The first heaven was created on the second day of creation, the boundaries of the first heaven is from the clouds down to the earth, therefore the second heaven begins from the ending of the first heaven to the beginning of the third heaven. Seeing the earth is a sphere, and the first heaven is also a sphere, we could conclude that the second and third heaven are also spheres, only each encircles the other. The earth was without form, meaning it was under water until the third day of creation, moving like molten lava, without any form at all. Secondly it was void, much like a baby in the womb during the first trimester, knowing eventually the babies legs, feet and toes will grow along with the arms, hands a fingers, but at this stage it is void of those parts. Just as the earth was void of trees, plant life, vegetation and such like. When God created the light, the Apostle Paul taught that light was all that the Lord Jesus preached about during his earthly ministry. 11 Cor. 4:6 The four categories that the Lord Jesus and the Apostle Paul taught are as follows, the gospel, the New testament, the gospel of the kingdom and the new covenant, all of which make up the light God created on the first day of creation. Then God separated the light from the darkness, let us acknowledge, God did not create the darkness, it was there already, but he divided it from the light. Now if the light is known as knowledge according to what the apostle Paul wrote in 2 Cor. 4:6 then darkness is also knowledge using metaphors for both light and darkness. The big question that remains is what could God use to separate bad knowledge from good knowledge? The answer is a world, it appears that God created a world for darkness to dwell in, as we study 2 Cor. 4:4 Satan is the god of the world darkness.

I'm unsure what you mean by this when applied to the KJV 1611, but for general writing using multiple pages, the word is called a 'catchword', but this is not normally done or used today. It was required a few decades ago as far as I remember, having used it in official Defence papers. But if you're thinking of something else, please give more details or an example.

I will comment on versus 17-19

The Lord Jesus said he did not come to destroy the Law of God, meaning the Ten Commandments in stone, rather he taught he came to fulfill that law, knowing it would expire as soon as he fulfilled it. :18 Apparently by the time that John the Baptist started his ministry, the Lord Jesus Christ had fulfilled the law, therefore it was now expired. Luke 16:16 According to the Apostle Paul, Christians have died unto that Law of God, Romans 7:4 knowing all Christians are delivered from the Ten Commandments in stone. Romans 7:6-7 that being dead to us. Then does the Lord Jesus speak of the least commandments in :19 When reading Mark 12:29-31 the Lord Jesus calls the Ten Commandments written the the heart, the greatest commandments, therefore, all other commandments found in the New Testament are the least commandments. I have studied the entire New Testament and discovered about twelve hundred commandments were given in seventeen different categories. All of these commandments are known as the least commandments. For Christians to become great in the kingdom of God today, they must practice the least commandments and teach others the least commandments also, as these two things are required in conditional promises, if someone desires to become great in God's kingdom.

I will speak of versus 19-21;

Here the apostle Paul gives warning unto all Christians concerning the millennial kingdom, he warns if Christians live an ungodly lifestyle of immorality in these seventeen sins or the like, they cannot inherit the kingdom of God. This warning is specifically speaking about not inheriting a kingdom, it is not speaking of Christians who live immoral lifestyles cannot go to heaven. The Kingdom of God is based upon conditional promises, Christians must qualify in order for them to make it into the millennial kingdom of God, otherwise they will remain in heaven until the thousand year kingdom has expired before being resurrected. The Apostle Paul gives this same warning in 1 Cor. 6:9-10 and Ephesians 5:3-5 Even the Lord Jesus taught conditional promises must be met before a Christian is counted worthy to enter the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 7:21 The Lord Jesus taught if we bury our pounds we are denied entrance into the Millennial kingdom of Christ, as we must meet the conditions to qualify us. Luke 19:12-27 Again, the Apostle Paul taught conditional promises are required to make it into the millennial kingdom, as we must through much tribulation enter that kingdom of God. Acts 14:22

Hi Gigi

I know you believe in what you believe.

The problem I have is you are going outside of scripture to prove your point.

Again remember 2 Tim 3:16

All the answers are within scripture.

Thanks

I looked at this list of passages that you say prove the trinity.

There is no proof of the trinity in these passages.

Some of the verses have nothing to do with our Lord.

The most interesting one is acts 17:30

If you had kept reading (verse 31) It is talking about a man.

The Lord Jesus Christ.

Act 5:30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.

Act 5:31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Jesus was exalted by God. If he was exalted it must mean he was lower in position.

Act 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

Again a man approved of God.

God did these miracle through Jesus. Jesus is described as a man.

Jim With all due respect it is more profitable to get into the positives of what we have been given by God through

his Son jesus Christ then to get into this of what we're discussing. Being aware of our adversary is one thing, I

deal with this on a need to know basis. But I'm willing to share some things profitable to all concerned. We walk

on and in what we think about so I endeavor to think most about what we have in Christ or Philippians 4:8+9.

Hi Rick Mentzer;

After reading your comment I see you are confusing the Old Testament with the old covenant, these are not the same thing, the old covenant is the Ten Commandments in stone, the Lord Jesus fulfilled it, then he took it away as it had an expiry date Matthew 5:18, it would only last until he fulfilled it. Christ did fulfill it by the time of John the Baptist, therefore he gave the expiry date again Luke 16:16 But when we speak about the Old Testament it was destroyed on the cross, being nailed to the cross and abolished Ephesians 2:14-16 and Colossians 2:14-15 not the old English word abolished means to destroy.

Sorry, I forgot to finish my sentence. It should read "They already received the Holy Ghost, and now Peter says can any man forbid water?"

Hi Rod;

I read what you wrote and questions have arisen from your thoughts, you stated the Old Testament was not destroyed based upon Ephesians 2:14-16 and Colossians 2:14-15, I think you should re=read those scriptures again and pray over them for meaning, also, if the Old Testament is not destroyed can you obey even one Old Testament law today? Knowing if you do, you are cursed as a Christians to obey all 613 laws from the Old Testament. Galatians 3:10 Then you said I should read Hebrews 9:11-14 stating the ordinances are no longer of value because of the blood of Christ, I do not think these verses are teaching what you are implying at all, as this is about the blood of Christ cleaning our conscience, not about him removing the Old Testament by his blood. You then went on to talk about the Ten Commandments in stone from Matthew 5:18 and then you quoted it again from Galatians 5:14, I will ask this question, do you know the difference between the old covenant and the Old Testament? By your thoughts it appears you think they are the same thing, otherwise why mention the Law of God, when I was talking about the Old Testament being destroyed? The Ten Commandments in stone is the old covenant, it is not a testament, please do not confuse them, they must be kept separate, as the old covenant was replaced with the new covenant, meaning the Ten Commandments in the heart. Hebrews 8:6-7 But the Old Testament was not replaced it was destroyed.

Jim A proverb is a[ descriptive saying] look up King of babylon in scripture notice the lord is going against the

king of babylon because all worship or anything tied to this not good. You are reading figurative language and

literal. Again look at Ezekiel 28:2-6 this is a description of lucifer's absolute pride so you have an example

of who this king was like in His kingdom. Then again look at verses 13-15.

Hemo,

I would also say the answer to that is no. Here is why I say this: In Acts 10:44-48, we see the pouring out of the Holy Spirit upon the Gentiles. It tells us in Verse 44 that while Peter was speaking a message that the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. Notice it fell on them that heard the word, not fell on them after they were baptized.

Now look at Acts 10:45. It says that they of the circumcision (That would be the believing Jews), they were astonished. Why? Because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Spirit. You see, the Holy Spirit was poured out on them before being water baptized. We know this because Peter says in Verse 47, "Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?"

Did you catch that? Can any man forbid water (Water to baptize them), that these (The Gentiles who the Holy Spirit fell upon), which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? They already receive the Holy Ghost, and now Peter

So the Gentiles now were receiving the Holy Ghost the same way that the believing Jews were. And these Gentiles received the Holy Ghost prior to being water baptized.

My belief is that water baptism comes after salvation and is a public testimony that a person has already received the Holy Spirit, not as a requirement to receive the Spirit. I know water baptism is a very sensitive topic, so before anyone crucifies me for sharing my belief on this, please understand that I am not against water baptism. I myself have been water baptized and I believe a person should be water baptized as a public testimony to others that an inward change has already taken place in their life. In other words, that person has already been born of God's Spirit, and water baptism is an outward testimony that I already have His Spirit in me and I am identifying with His death, burial, and resurrection.

Hi Alex N.

I appreciate your comment, hope these posts can be of some help to you.

Hi Rick Mentzer;

It is true when you say today we give from the heart, but this is not the case when you are being told Malachi 3:8-10 God will curse you if you do not tithe. Why do people not understand that in Malachi, God wanted meat in his house, not money, as Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy all testify that tithing has nothing to do with money, it is always about fruits, vegetables and animals, and a man must eat his tithe with his wife, children, slaves, and a Levitical priest, once every year. The freedom you spoke of is an illusion for many who do not know the bible, that tithing was for Israel alone, and it was destroyed with all the other laws of Moses from the Old Testament. Now do I really care about tithing, no, I care about people not obeying one Old Testament law, otherwise they will be cursed to obey all the 613 laws from the Old Testament. Galatians 3:10 % Galatians 5:1-4

James Evans In reality His resurrected body could reappear disappear eat food be touched and travel with supernatural capabilities that's what scripture shows. Examples Mark 16:12 appeared in another form, in luke

24:12 he lifted out of His burial clothes, luke 24:31 after teaching vanished in front of them, verses 36-42

appeared instantly and was touched and ate food then in Acts one elevated up to heaven.

Hi Jimmy D NixI. We know in scripture it says there will come a day when the Lion shall lie down with the lamb. And the child shall put his hand forth to the vipers nest and shall not be heart. We also know there will be beast around the throne, and horses in heaven. What we do not know is if these animals are animals which have passed away on the earth and gone to kingdom or if these will be newly created animals.

Amen David. Yah will not force himself upon anyone. It is our duty to seek his face lest we perish. And it is his desire that all be saved. Thank you David for the word, may you be encouraged thereby.

Hemo If your goal is to be born again via the spirit then Romans 10:9+10 confess the saviour from sine and confess Jesus Christ as Lord and that God raised him from the dead and mean it then line your lifestyle up with Gods Word and let

the word do the work.

Jim Also the term morning or daystar are figurative descriptions for lucifer who at one time was Gods top

angel or messenger. There are more scripture involved in this if your interested but a lot of scripture are

different descriptions of operational methods after His downfall.

Hi Rick

Isa 14:4 notice that it is a proverb against the king of Babylon. Verse 11 he is brought down to the grave. Worms under and over him. Verse 16 Is this the man? These verses are about the king of Babylon.