Discuss Luke 7 Page 2

Hanna Fowler,

Sometimes we have to find out who we are not, & who we don't want to be, before we find out who we are. I've told several people at times before testings & temptation we can say "I'd never" but as Peter under the real pressure gave in, we really don't know how we handle trial & temptation until testing. (We're to pray that God deliver us & lead us not into temptation ' Matthew 6,) Luke 22:31-34, Luke 22:40-62, Matthew 26:75, John 21:17, later Peter became a bold preacher read all the book of Acts to see Peter's boldness afterward. Here's a few: Acts 2:38-47, Acts 2:14, this is in the Bible for those of us who need this encouragement. Also this scripture : Luke 7:47, in context Luke 7:37-50,

Here are a few more: Mark 1:15, Acts 2:38, John 3:15-16, Acts 3:19, Romans 3:22-25,

Romans 5:8, "But God commendeth his love towards us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."

Ephesians 5,

Ephesians 5:8 "For ye were sometimes darkness, but now ye are light in the Lord: walk as children of the light."

Matthew 7, Matthew 25:31-46, 2Corinthians 1:4,

Hopefully these are all helpful

Mark 16:16

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned"

How do you know she wasn't baptized, she truly adored JESUS and would of fallowed HIS teachings where HE went to John the Baptist himself and was baptized.

Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Is 28:19 not a commandment of CHRIST?

At the end of luke 7 jesus told the woman ,thy faith has saved thee go in peace,which tells us all that salvation comes through faith not in water baptism or any other ordnance of the church,but faith and faith alone saves a person

Prophets, Prophetic, gifts of Prophecy in New Testament

Romans 12:6,

2Peter 1:16-21,

1Timothy 4:14,

Revelation 1:3,

Gifting working within the Body: 1Corinthians 12, 1Corinthians 13, direction concerning in Church: 1Corinthians 14:29-40,

Prophets yet to come: Revelation 11:3-19, false prophet yet to come: Revelation 16:12-15, Revelation 19:20, Revelation 20:10,

Revelation 19:10,

Revelation 22,

John the Baptist referred to as Prophet: Luke 1:76, Luke 3:4, Matthew 13:57, Mark 6:4, Luke 4:24, Luke 7:26,28, Luke 20:3-20, John 1:19-37,

Acts 3:22-26, Acts 7:35-60, Titus 1:12,

Matthew 10:41,

Jesus talking about Prophets in HIS day, referred to himself also: Matthew 21:26, Matthew 11:9, Mark 11:32, John 4:4,

Luke 13:33, Luke 24,

Paul & others acknowledged prophecy, Prophets, even Women that did Prophecy: Acts 21:8-14,

Hope these are helpful

Please know that I do not mean to cause any discord here. But I would like to point out that the verses you gave: Matthew 15:31, Matthew 11:5, and Luke 7:22 are not proof of the indwelling Holy Spirit and the anointing or the evidence of gifts of the Holy Spirit. When these words were spoken, the Holy Spirit had not come yet so no one could have had the indwelling Spirit at that time.

Matthew 15:31

Insomuch that the multitude wondered, when they saw the dumb to speak, the maimed to be whole, the lame to walk, and the blind to see: and they glorified the God of Israel.

Matthew 11:5

The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the gospel preached to them.

Luke 7:22

Then Jesus answering said unto them, Go your way, and tell John what things ye have seen and heard; how that the blind see, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, to the poor the gospel is preached.

This is proof of the indwelling Holy Spirit and the anointing or the evidence of gifts of the Holy Spirit. I'm going to encourage women to exercise their faith.

We'll just have to be at peace with our different interpretations.

Additional scripture for you:

Matthew 3-7, Matthew 5, Matthew 5:20, Matthew 9:10-13, Matthew 9:14-17, Matthew 9:27-34, Matthew 12:14, Matthew 12, Matthew 15, Matthew 16, Matthew 16:6,12, Matthew 19:3, * Matthew 21, Matthew 22, Matthew 22:15, it appears they were wrongfully referring to the book of Tobet, in 1611 version, Tobit 3:7,8, Matthew 22:29,

* Matthew 23:2, whole chapter Matthew 23, Matthew 27:62,

Matthew 23:13,14,

Mark 2:16, Mark 2, Mark 3:1-6, Mark 7:1-23, Mark 8:11,15, Mark 10:2, Mark 12:13,

Luke 5:17-39, Luke 6:2-11, Luke 7:29-50, Luke 11:37-54, Luke 12:1, Luke 12:31, Luke 14:1-24, Luke 14, Luke 16:14-31, Luke 16, Luke 19:35-39,

John 1:19-34, John 3:1-21, John 7:28-32, John 7:43-53, John 8:3-22, John 9, John 9:15,16, John 11:37-57, John 12:19, John 12:42, John 18:3,

Acts 15, Acts 23,

Hopefully these are helpful in your study, I included several Chapters to read next to verses, to read within context, for better understanding

Psalm 38: 21-22 kjv, Luke 7:13 kjv.

Very interesting question. Only God can forgive sin; but we are told to "confess our sins to one another". ( James 5:16). We are told to reconcile with a brother before "offering a gift before the altar" ( Matthew 5:24). If we bear unforgiveness in our hearts; then the effectiveness of His grace is stunted; for the woman who put the perfume on Christ was forgiven much so she loved much ( Luke 7:47).

All of us individually are accountable before God. We can forgive "seventy times seven" ( Matthew 18:22); and Ephesians 4:32 indicates that we are to forgive others even as God has forgiven us. If we don't forgive others then God won't forgive us according to Matthew 6:14-15. This wouldn't necessarily indicate that we are nonbelievers; but if we don't bear fruit "worthy of repentence" ( Matthew 3:8-10) then we have to seriously test ourselves to see if we are in the faith ( 2 Cor. 13:5).

So the short answer is that God can only forgive others if they are wanting forgiveness. Each of us is judged individually; and since we are not God we don't have the authority as Christ did to forgive sins as the Pharisees stated only God can forgive sins ( John 20:23). Confessing our sins to one another can allow transparency so that the Lord can possibly speak a word of wisdom which in turn gives someone a better understanding of themselves; as well as clearing up what can be a stone wall in relationships ( Prov. 18:19). The best we can do is a formulaic process to give a partial assessment of sins in others as only God knows the intentions and motives of the heart even if the Spirit gives us a glimpse into such things. It is the same as asking can we save anyone by "confessional regeneration". The words are only effective if God grants one repentance first ( Acts 11:18; etc). Indirectly then; forgiving one another allows God to repair the sin or estrangement with Him.

This morning I thought more on Lazarus & the parable of Lazarus, in thinking about it: maybe the parable/story was also about how the "Rich" in scriptural knowledge, not sharing or helping while Lazarus had "wounds the dogs would._." alone in his suffering, while the other had historical words of hope, healing, redemption, deliverance.

Just thinking: even though Lazarus in real life may not have been financially poor, his sister had been tormented by 7 demons, in front of the ' religious ' for they judged her openly, Lazarus who dwelt with his sister/s suffered.

Jesus walks in, delivers, redeems, forgives, restores & teaches GOD's words. Mark 16:9, Luke 5:17, Luke 5:29-32, Mark 2:14-17, Matthew 9:10-13, Luke 8:2, Mark 16:9,

John 11:2, John 12:1-11, Luke 7:36-50, Luke 8:2, believing Mary to be Mary Madgelene, & reading John 11:2, (as the only time Jesus feet were anointed with oil, & wiped by a Mary's hair)

Luke 16, interestingly in the Parable/story the "rich" man cried "Father Abraham, have mercy._.._" & "if they hear not Moses an the Prophets._."

John 11, & John 12,

Hi Haold, or maybe, Harold. That's a difficult question to answer, as we are not told an exact number of people resurrected. Some that come to mind from the Old & New Testaments are: Widow of Zarephath's son ( 1 Kings 17:9-24); Shunammite woman's son ( 2 Kings 4:8-37); an unnamed man ( 2 Kings 13:20,21); Widow of Nain's son ( Luke 7:11-17); Jairus' daughter ( Luke 8:49-56); Lazarus ( John 11:1-45); of course, our Lord Jesus Christ (Luke chapter 24); an unknown number of saints buried in Jerusalem ( Matthew 27:50-54); Tabitha ( Acts 9:36-42); Eutychus ( Acts 20:7-12).

Jesus Christ is God:

Deity is the only explanation for all that He was and all that He did.

(1) He was pre-existent with the Father. "The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made that was made" ( John 1:2, 3, KJV). (Also see John 17:5 and Colossians 1:17.)

(2) He is the Son of God.

His enemies admitted: "He...said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God" ( John 5:18, KJV).

Peter confessed: "And we believe and are sure that thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God" ( John 6:69, KJV).

Jesus affirmed: "I and my Father are one" ( John 10:30, NIV).

(3) He was sinless, as only God can be.

Jesus challenged His enemies: "Which of you convinceth me of sin?" ( John 8:46, KJV).

Peter testified: "...Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example that ye should follow his steps: who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth" ( 1 Peter 2:21, 22, KJV).

Paul stated: "For he...made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him" ( 2 Corinthians 5:21, KJV).

(4) He forgives sin, as only God can.

The Scribes said: "Who can forgive sins but God only?" ( Mark 2:7, KJV).

Jesus said: "But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins..." ( Matthew 9:6, KJV). (Also see John 8:11.)

Peter wrote: "Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed" ( 1 Peter 2:24, KJV).

(5) He performed miraculous works.

He healed the sick: Matthew 8:9-13; Luke 4:31-44; 5:12-15; John 4:43 to 5:16; and other references.

He fed the hungry: John 6; Mark 8, etc.

He raised the dead: Luke 7:11-18; John 11:1-46.

Jesus Christ Became Man:

"And the Word was made flesh and dwelt among us...full of grace and truth" ( John 1:14, KJV). (See also Philippians 2:7, 8.)

Psalms 139, Isaiah 41:10,

Psalms 130:4, Colossians 1:14, Ephesians 1:7, Acts 26:18, Luke 7:47,48, Psalms 32:1, Acts 8:22, Psalms 85:2,

Ephesians 4:26,

Proverbs 11:3,

Psalms 119:16, Hebrews 2:18, James 1:12, 1Corinthians 10:13,

Hopefully these are helpful

Genesis 1:26-28, "them" "be fruitful & multiply" Genesis 1:31,

Note Genesis 3:24 "drove out the man" singular, Genesis 3:23, "from the Garden of Eden" Genesis 3:22, "the man" is become like one of us, to know good & evil" is this religion?

* Note, Genesis 4:14 ._._." everyone thst findeth me shall slay._." proof more people in earth. Genesis 4:15,

* Genesis 4:16, appears she was from Nod.

Likewise in Genesis 4:23, the man that was slain wasn't mentioned here.

If you read & study the WORD of GOD, many times you will notice names & several other details are left out at times. 1Kings 17:9-24, same Widow? = Luke 4:26, Luke 7:12, Luke 21:2-3, yet many names are mentioned, when studying often times their names come up again, helping understand a more vast picture. Genesis 6:1-2, is this also in reference to Genesis 4:19, ?

Note Genesis 5, generation of Adam leaves out Cain, Abel & all other people. Again: Genesis 5:1-2, Gen 5:3, "male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day they were created" = them, their, they.

Hopefully this is helpful

Kay,

2John 1:5-11, James 4:4-5, I'm reminded of 2Kings 20:12-18, Isaiah 39:1-7, Micah 7:5, Proverbs 19:4,= Job 19:14, Proverbs 14:20, Psalms 38:11,

Proverbs 19:7, Luke 21:16, Proverbs 19:6, Proverbs 18:24, Proverbs 27:6,

Even Jesus friends : Mark 3:21, Zechariah 13:6, Psalms 41:9, Luke 7:34, Matthew 11:19, Matthew 26:48-50

John 15:14-26, Job 42:10, -after = ( Job 32:3 ), Mark 5:19, Luke 14:12-14,

Hopefully these are helpful for wisdom in your love & wisdom towards GOD, your friends & close friends

Wow! The Book of Mark really compacts many important moments into 1 chapter & it's 1st Chapter.

Mark 1:1-5 : Exodus 15:2, Isaiah 40:3, Malachi 3:1, Matthew 3:3, Matthew 11:10, Luke 1:76, Luke 3:4, Luke 7:27,

Vrs 6.- compare: Jeremiah 13:1-11, 2Kings 1:8,

Mark 1:13, : Psalms 106:14, Matthew 4:1, Luke 4:2,

Mark 1:14, : Luke 3,

Mark 1:44, : Leviticus 10:10, Leviticus 13,

Isaiah 11:1-4,

Here are several scriptures I found about death & after death : James 2:26, Ecclesiasticus 38:23, Ecclesiasticus 22:11, 2 Maccabees 7:36, 2 Maccabees 12:44, Ecclesiasticus 10:11, Ecclesiasticus 17:28, Baruch, 2:17, Psalms 88:10, Psalms 115:11, Ecclesiastes 9:5,

after death,: Matthew 17:1-3, Luke 7:12-16, Luke 8:49-56, John 11:21-45, Matthew 27:50-54, Luke 16:22-31, John 21:14, Acts 3:15, Acts 4:10, Mark 12:25,26,27, Luke 24:46, John 5:12, John 5:25, 1 Peter 1:3, 1 Peter 2:24, 1 Peter 4:5, Revelation 1:5, Revelation 1:18, Revelation 14:9-20, 1 Corinthians 15:20,21, 2 Timothy 4:1, 1 Thessalonians 4:16, 1 Thessalonians 1:10, Matthew 25:31-46, Romans 14:9, Matthew 22:32, Isaiah 26:19,

Hebrews 11:35, Revelation 20, 2 Esdras 2:16, Hebrews 6:2, Hebrews 9:14, Hebrews 11:4, Hebrews 13:20, Revelation 11:18,

Hopefully these are helpful.

Thanks Catherine, for sharing more of yourself, past & present. It's certainly encouraging for us to read of you being 'in Christ' for just a short time & of the hunger you have for His precious Word. As the saying goes, 'the one who has been forgiven much, loves much'; taken from Luke 7:37-50, esp verse 47 (the woman lost in sin who sought Jesus' forgiveness & demonstrated her sorrow for her lifestyle & love for the Lord).

Indeed, this KJBO Site has much to offer, & particularly giving us the opportunity to have solid Christian fellowship around God's Word. We're not always in agreement on everything (then again, who is?), but we are focussing our hearts & minds on that which really matters: the Word of God, getting to know Him better, & building one another up in union with the Spirit's ministry in our hearts, and not on the fickle mundane things that occupy the world's minds. So, keep coming back here & sharing in our conversations & whatever is on your heart.

Faith for Healing It was the same situation in Luke 7:1-10 with the centurion servant because the centurion

heard of Jesus and Believed who He was never meeting Him and knew if Jesus said it that settled it. Verse 9 speaks

loudly still. What we really believe is what we receive It IS Written.

Jesus held a great regard for Johns ministry. They were cousins. Mary and Elizabeth were related.

Luke 7:28

For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist: but he that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.

Matthew 11:11

Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

John 13:16

Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord; neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him.

Anthony A few points Jesus Christ was originally sent for the lost sheep of the House of Israel, most of

what he was teaching was to that peoples and culture, but when certain individuals came to Him and Believed

who He Is The Son Of God and didn't see only heard of what He was doing I.E. the centurion Luke 7:2 understood

the authority Given to Jesus and by messenger said He was not worthy although he was in charge of 100 men

and said at your word and His servant was healed, he believed without seeing. Most times in Gospels they saw then

believed. Now to the judeans certain gentiles canaanites and others were considered un believing dogs so to

speak, and yet because of her believing will because she said Have mercy on me son of David therefore she heard

of Him and believed.

The washing of the hands was in criticism of the corruption of the religious leaders who appeared and

acted so self righteous and if you didn't eat with clean hands you can't be walking with God.

Jesus Christ came to fulfill and complete the law of the old testament and nailed it to the cross, so in the age

of grace we fulfill the law by walking in the spiritual law of agapeo the love of God when we are born again which was

not possible until the day of pentecost. In the age of Grace we are to believe Gods Word then we get the works,

in the gospels they mostly saw then believed. That's why Jesus said blessed are they who have not seen and will believe.

Alex. Luke 7:36-49 is clearly an account of a woman caught in sin but fallen at Jesus's feet. The Pharisee saw a wicked woman of the world touching a prophet of God. Jesus saw a sinful woman seeking forgiveness. The Pharisee would never forgive such a person, let alone come near her. Jesus saw her heart & forgave her on that basis.

What happened to the woman after that? We're not told. Hopefully, she abstained from such a lifestyle. Did she stop sinning as well? Did Jesus' forgiving her make her totally pure of all sin at that time & for the rest of her life? My guess, is that she, like us, still had sins popping up each day, & she remained, like us, guilty before God for those sins. Her story was all pre-Cross - how she responded to God from then & how God looked at her heart & life, we don't know. But we do know, that she, like us, will be judged for what we do with the Saviour of God.

Yes, we are to forgive one another, even our enemies - that is the Spirit's leading in our hearts. God's forgiveness is based on the response of the heart & post-Cross, that response has to be in line with what the Saviour has done for us & the world. If that forgiven woman continued to believe in the Lord & trusted Christ for her salvation, she would be saved. If she forsook Him & went back to her old ways, her judgement remains. If as you believe that God will forgive all inspite of what their spiritual state is, do you think that Satan will have half a chance of sneaking into God's Kingdom? If his disciples can all get in, why not the master?

Luke 8:2, Luke 8:1-4, the whole chapter is relevant actually to point out Jesus love for people deliverance, GOD's nature, Luke 8,

Mary Magdalene is mentioned: Mark 15:40-47, continues Mark 16:1-14, Matthew 27:55-56 (followed Jesus from Galilee), Matthew 27:59-61, Matthew 28:1-10, Luke 23:49-56 continues Luke 24:1-10,22-24, John 19:25,

Luke 10:38-42, John 20:1-18,

* John 11:1-8, John 11:1-45

* John 12:1-3,

Luke 7:36-50- Luke 8:1-3, same account?

John 12,

Hopefully you enjoy this study.

Carlene,

You can find this account in Luke 7:36-50 which shows the proof of forgiveness. There is a very important message in that section of scripture. The woman's name is not given.

Luke 7:34

The Son of man is come eating and drinking; and ye say, Behold a gluttonous man, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners!

Matthew 11:19

The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.

Wesley's Notes for LUKE 7:34

7:34 But wisdom is justified by all her children - The children of wisdom are those who are truly wise unto salvation. The wisdom of God in all these dispensations, these various methods of calling sinners to repentance, is owned and heartily approved by all these.

Wesley's Notes for MATTHEW 11:19

11:19 The Son of man came eating and drinking - Conversing in a free, familiar way. Wisdom is justified by her children - That is, my wisdom herein is acknowledged by those who are truly wise.

People's Bible Notes for MATTHEW 11:19The Son of man came eating. Like other men. He was at the wedding feast of Cana (Joh 2:2); at Matthew's feast, ( Mt 9:10), etc. A winebibber. There was nothing singular about his social habits. Like all the people, he drank the light, harmless wine of Palestine, either free from, or with a very slight percentage of, alcohol. Our modern wines are very different. A friend of tax collectors and sinners. See notes on Mt 9:12,13. Wisdom is justified of her children. Those who are wise will approve both the course of John and his Lord.

There seems to be several times that occurs throughout the Bible, Is it to show us to view each person individually? Several were opposites, yet similar; is that to inspire us to be our best? Luke 7:19-28,

Interestingly Saul, Saul/Paul, 1 Samuel 15, Acts 13:9, Saul continued to do wickedly, Saul/Paul repentantly changed Acts 8,

Tamar, Tamar, 2 Samuel 13, 2 Samuel 13:19-20, Genesis 38, 1 Chronicles 2:4, Ruth 4:12,

Manasseh, Manasseh: Joshua 17:1-18, Genesis 48:14,20, 2 Chronicle 30:11, Psalms 108:8, Jeremiah 15:4, 2 Chronicles 33:1, Isaiah 9:28, 2 Chronicles 33:10,22,

Lazarus, Lazarus, John 11, John 12:10, John 12:1-3, Luke 16:20, was one rich one poor?

Etc.

Hebrews 9:10

Precious friends, since God is "not the author of Confusion" 1 Corinthians 14:33, Would He not "Have The Biblical Answer" to all The denominational Confusion {I found 10 'Different water baptismal traditions' today...}? Please Be Encouraged And Edified!

Part 1

{Borrowed from 12 baptisms "study"} ONE of Israel's various {divers} washings! Greek: Baptismos = Hebrews 9:10:

4. Levitical priesthood baptism Exodus 29:4 Leviticus 8:6 Numbers 8:7. This washing was The Second Requirement { The First being: "NO blemish!" Leviticus 21:21 }, in order to become a priest under the Law of Moses! Is this baptism in any way connected To baptism # 9?:

9. "water" baptism of repentance that John preached (Before The Cross), And Peter continued (After The Cross!), to preach! Matthew 3:5-6 Mark 1:4 Luke 3:3 John 1:31 Luke 7:29-30 Acts 10:37 Matthew 28:19 Mark 16:16 Acts 2:38 Acts 22:16 Ezekiel 36:25.

a) Does this baptism "save" anyone Luke 7:29-30?

b1) Is this baptism in any way "connected" to baptism # 4?

b2) Wasn't John preparing National Israel for God's Promise For them "to be a nation of priests unto God" Exodus 19:6?

b3) Was not The Second Requirement for priesthood induction, Washing? { may require re-review of baptism #4! }.

b4) Did not CHRIST And The Twelve "heal" everyone in Israel who came to them, in order to meet "The FIRST Requirement" For the priesthood, that Of "NO blemish!"? Matthew 4:24 Acts 5:16 cp Leviticus 21:21

Semi - conclusion? God {has Not 10 baptismS Today, but ONLY} ONE Baptism = Confusion SOLVED! And "PEACE {Not Confusion} In ALL the churches!" 1 Corinthians 14:33 Amen? Link

More questions - to be continued in Part 2

Hi Ready Correct doctrine always produces positive fruit and is a Glory to God,I.E. in luke 4:31+32 he taught in the synagogues and his word was with power again. In luke 7:1-10 with the centurion servant the centurion knew and believed that what Jesus Christ spoke words doctrine produced positive results good fruit. By their fruits they shall be known. In 2 Peter 1-8 verse 8 Fir if these things be in you and abound they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Hello again my brother in Christ

Appreciate your kind comments on my last post.

To begin, my comment concerning the number of resurrections from death by Christ must have not been clear to you. I know of only 3 recorded resurrections performed by Christ: Lazarus, John 11:1-44; the widow's son, Luke 7:11-17; and Jairus's daughter, Luke 8:40-56 I then expressed my opinion there were most likely more that were not recorded. I see Christ as a compassionate savior, and personally, believe more miracles were performed than are recorded in today's Bible.

My conviction the story of Lazarus the beggar is a parable is based on the Hebrew meaning of the name Lazarus meaning "God has helped". Christ was speaking to an audience of disciples originally and some Pharisees later joined the group, verse 14, and began to deride Christ. Christ then speaks to the Pharisees as to their violations of the Law and the parable of Lazarus.

The parable of Lazarus serves a twofold purpose. First it serves to emphasize the responsibility of those more fortunate to aid the less fortunate. Second, it foretales the rejection of Christ by the Jews, even after the resurrection. The first purpose most likely fell on deaf ears as the Pharisees because of their self-righteousness. The second was not realized and accepted by even the remaining 11 disciples initially.

Reference to the place of the spirit after death until the gathering of the church by Christ is referenced after the resurrection by Paul, in many places in scripture. Paul refers to the "holding place: as sleep.

Now, where did the souls John sees in Revelation come from and at what point did they arrive in heaven. Revelation 3:10 is easily interperted as the rapture before tribulation. Revelation 7:9-17 surely is post-rapture by content.

My point - the spirit of the vast majority of Christians do not enter heaven prior to the rapture. Enoch, perhaps. Elijiah definitely ( 2 Kings 2:11).

Thank you, my brother in Christ