Genesis Chapter 4 Discussion Page 4

S Spencer, Yes eve was the first of all living in the flesh, Christ is the first of all living the Spirit.

There are no races, sir. God has only created one race. The human race. God has created all nations to on earth from one blood. The blood of Adam.

Walt, may CHRIST IN US grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.

Man didn't start with eve; man started with Christ. Adam was just a shadow of the TRUE FIRST MAN CREATED.

Revelation 3:14 .... the faithful and true witness, THE BEGINNING OF THE CREATION OF GOD...

The true witness is Christ.

Revelation 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness....

Revelation 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the BEGINNING and the ENDING....

Jesus was the first man created; and when HIS WORKS are finished, He will be the LAST MAN created.

Psalms 104:30 Thou sendest forth thy spirit, and THEY ARE CREATED; and thou renewest the face of the earth.

Psalms 102:18 This shall be written for the generation to come: and the people which SHALL BE CREATED shall praise the Lord.

Romans 8:29 For whom he (GOD) did foreknow (ALL CREATION), he also did predestinate to be CONFORMED TO THE IMAGE OF HIS SON, that he (THE SON) might be the firstborn (FIRST MAN OF CREATION) among many brethren (LAST MAN OF CREATION).

Hi Walt.

Yes, no reason to believe otherwise.

Genesis 3:20 (KJV) And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of "" ALL living.""

Did all man kind/all races of man start with Eve?

So does God have powers?

Does God love us more than those who came before us? From Pentecost to now, have we become more holy or more worthy that we should be spared from what all the believers in Christ had to endure that came before us? The body of Christ in the past have been stoned, beheaded, crucified, impaled and dipped in oil, lit as lamps along roadsides, burned at the stake, fed to lions, killed by gladiators, and tortured beyond imagination. Inflicted by kingdoms, empires, and countries throughout history even by the Roman Catholic Church, and is still going on. Do we think the end times will be worse than they have had to endure?

Why should the last generation be spared? "Take heed that no man deceive you"!

The great tribulation and the wrath of God, are not the same thing. We will be spared the wrath of God, but we have been promised tribulations, the wrath of God is after the second coming of Christ when there is no more repentance.

Acts.14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.

1 Thessalonians 3:4 For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation; even as it came to pass, and ye know.

Matthew 24:21,29 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

1 Thessalonians 1:10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

Revelation 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Out of love, Ron

Hi Dorothy,

Hopefully these may be the verses you were looking for:

James 4:13-15 Go to now, ye that say, To day or to morrow we will go into such a city, and continue there a year, and buy and sell, and get gain:

Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away.

For that ye ought to say, If the Lord will, we shall live, and do this, or that.

Maybe Proverbs 3:5-6. Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

God Bless.

Where does it say when plain for your future put God

first, something like that.

does anyone consider Cain and Abel as Esau and Isaac? any connections?

God must be mad,he multiply Cain for who slew his brother.

I love God and god love me to and I love his word

This would be an extremely difficult case to build as Paul is simply not specific to what was given him to keep him from becoming conceited after those mighty revelations.

I have always tended to believe that his eyes caused him a lot of bother. Whether he had first acquired some disease that eventually affected other parts of his body in the long term & especially his eyes, one can't be certain. Anyway, I'll give you some other Scriptures for you to consider (not in any order):

a. Romans 16:22 (Paul was the author, but Tertius his scribe possibly because of Paul's vision).

b. 1 Corinthians 16:21 & 2 Thessalonians 3:17 (Paul managed to sign off with his name while others helped with the writing of the epistle).

c. Galatians 6:11 (Paul wrote in large letters, rather than writing a 'long letter', as he didn't have a scribe to help him).

d. Galatians 4:13 (Paul preached to the Galatians first, possibly because of the region's higher altitude may have helped with a disease, e.g. malaria which left untreated, might have caused eye problems) & then in Galatians 4:15 (that the Galatians would have given him "their eyes" for his need).

e. Acts 23:3-5 (Paul insulted the High Priest not recognizing him, or as some suppose, that Paul was saying "I didn't expect a High Priest (of his calibre) to order me beaten").

Sorry, I'm directing this response towards Paul's eyes, as I feel that this was where his infirmity was. But of course, no one can say with full certainty.

"Building a case on Paul's thorn in the flesh"

Please brethren help me build a case on Paul's thorn in the flesh. I need your help gathering scripture, verses, and any information regarding "Paul's Thorn" so far I have discovered a few possibilities. In

( 2 Corinthians 12:5-10) Paul mentions:Verse 5 "infirmities" then in verse 7 he mentions the "thorn in the flesh" but in the same verse he wrote "the messenger of satan" and it also says "to buffet me" then in verse 9 he mentions "infirmities" again.

But in verse 10 this is where it gets interesting he mentions ("infirmities" "reproaches" "necessities" "persecution" and "distresses".) So far I have found one major clue its in ( Acts 28:1-6) it's right after they survived the shipwreck and landed in Melita. It mentions a venomous snake in verse 3 that "fastened on his hand" but I know there are many other possibilities for Paul's thorn in the flesh. Some scholars mention he had eye problems or that he was beaten, others say he had men who opposed him. Can you please help me gather proof on these claims please. God Bless you all in Jesus Christ's name, Amen.

Thanks Chris, That's very clear.

Page 2.

Romans 2:14,15 clearly show that the Law was never in our possession & we've never been subject to them. And then when the Gentiles became believers, the only instruction given was, not that any of the commandments given to the Jews be followed, but as per Acts 15:19,20: "Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood."

Rather, our directive can never be from the Law given to Israel, because "the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death." ( Romans 8:2). If the Life-giving Spirit freed a Jewish Paul from the bondage of the Law, how much more to us Gentiles, who never received the Law, are only subject to the Spirit's directions in our lives.

Again, thank you for bringing up those very worthy points.

Page 1.

Thank you for your comments Steven, on this important subject. If I may add some thoughts here:

a. "They don't view the ten commandments as our schoolmaster to show us our short comings, and a need for a savior but rather they're instructions to salvation". Indeed, some do look at salvation in this way, but I think generally, Christians who have been taught properly, don't see that obedience to the Commandments are necessary for salvation, rather, that after being saved, they revert back to it, or fuse it with saving faith, believing God requires to almost use it like a checklist to be on track & to please Him. See how much of an issue Sabbath-keeping is with some. But as you indicated, all that does is bring us back into bondage to the Law.

b. "Did Jesus struggle to resist sin as we do?" This may be difficult to answer but I rather believe that at his temptation with Satan ( Matthew 4:1-11) & very likely throughout His earthly ministry, Satan would have continued to come at Him: and this was to force sin upon Him so a sin nature may be born in Him. I say this, as we see that the first Adam was born without a sin nature, but he failed to resist Satan, & he inherited a nature given to sin & death eventually followed. So when we read that "as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned" ( Romans 5:12), the fact we too die is proof of the sin nature being transmitted, rather than the import of any specific sins of Adam.

c. "we were transgressors before the commandments, and when the commandments came we died because we became sin." I tend to make a clear demarcation between those given the Law & those who haven't received it. Certainly, we are privileged to have the Bible so we can learn more fully of God's requirements, but if we're not Jews, how are the Laws, then & now, applicable to Gentiles?

We often get questions on whether Jesus could have committed sin, some believe he had a sin nature but was just obedient, and all we have to be obedient and trust in Christ and we shall be saved, ( In that order, SANCTIFICATION AND THEN SALVATION AFTER THAT. ) They don't view the ten commandments as our schoolmaster to show us our short comings, and a need for a savior but rather they're instructions to salvation. But how can they be instructions for salvation if they were impossible to keep being we have this cursed sin nature? If you can keep all the commandments why is there a need to be born again? If we are not born with a sin nature why are we baptized in Jesus death? Did Jesus struggle to resist sin as we do? Better yet did struggle with doing the right thing as we do? ""NO"". If we go to hell it will be because we didn't believe in he who was promised to come 430 years before the commandments, because we was transgressors before the commandments, and when the commandments came we died because we became sin. Jesus came to take the PENALTY of sin "which is death" off us and placing it on himself and defeating death when he rose from the dead! so if we was baptized in his death we should walk in newness of life by his resurrection, So sanctification comes after salvation. Man isn't a sinner because he committed a sin, Man commits sin because he is a sinner. ( EXAMPLE) You take a man biting dog and tie him up. he's now unable to bite is he still a man biting dog? The ability of man able to sin makes him imperfect and unholy apart from Jesus Christ. So if you want to be judged by your achievements you're still in bondage, if you trust in Christ you are freed. Thank you.

Hi Jocelyn, Genesis 1:28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: Now lets start here, If God tells them to be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth, God knows they can't do that with just Cain, Seth, and Abel. He would have to have blessed them with daughters, Have you noticed noone ever ask that about Seth or Abel? I believe it's because Cain went out and dwelt in the lad of nod after he killed Abel, and the think he found a wife from a pryor creation, but they forget God told Adam and Eve to replenish the earth it wasn't already replenished. Lets look carefully at when Cain went away, I think we may have a clue. Genesis 4:14-17 Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, (that every one that findeth me shall slay me).

And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain,( lest any finding him should kill him.)

And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.

(And Cain knew his wife;) and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch. It seems there were already people other than Cain and Abel, and I take the position Cain already have his wife, they could have been hundreds of years old, we are sure Adam and Eve had daughters, and Possibly Abel, One thing for sure, She's either his sister or his niece, Maybe someone else can provide more insight, I hope that helps.

where did cain wife come from

They also called Jesus son of David, Obviously the word son is often used different in scripture, I've seen where someone posted God is a spirit Jesus cant be God, Well using that same reasoning how can a spirit have a son?

Question, if EVE were the only women, I am not understanding where did Cain wife come about

Moses is pointing out the sinning blood line of Cains murder. That family never spoke one word of the Lord but it did keeps its evil sinning murderous ways.

Kelly's Question: Who are these other people that live outside of Eden? God created Adam, and from Adam He created Eve, Eve bore Cain, then bore Able whom Cain killed. So who is it that Cain is afraid will kill him if they see him?

Answer: Although the Bible does not give the timeline of events during earlier chapters of Genesis it can be assumed that there were several years, perhaps even a hundred in which other births of Adam and Eve's who have grown up and knowing ALL of their siblings, it quite reasonable to see that Cain [may have] been concerned for their retaliating on behalf of Abel. Of course this is just a reasonable guess, but not without the obvious conclusion(s).

Hi I have a strange question for you where did the women come from that Cain took his wife Where did she come from? Was she his sister we all come from Adam and Eve Thank you for your answering if you can and I do hope you have a great day. Sincerely Theresa

Where did Cain's wife come from?

Because he doesn't go around taking life. Instead he lays down the rules and allows us to make free choices. Judgement day is coming when ALL (even the devil) be judged based on those choices.

We are not told specifically what made Cain's offering unacceptable to the Lord (in Genesis 4:3-5). It has been suggested that Cain came with a heart that was not right before God, whether he harboured sin, or thought light of fulfilling such an important duty. Then again, even though sacrifices were not officially commanded by God at that time, there may have been the idea (from their parents) that a blood offering was only acceptable for sin offering. As well, Adam & Eve would have been familiar with the killing of animals as God had done, so as to clothe them at their time of sin. Abel did correctly by taking of the first of his flock but Cain only produced what grew from his field, & this may have not been acceptable as a Sacrifice.

Genesis 4

Cain killed Abel because his gift

Hid unconfessed sins, but the lift

Came when Seth learned to call on God

For all that grows upon the sod.

Yes, I do not understand the sin of Cain before he killed his brother. God was pleased with Abel's gift but not with Cain's gift. Cain became jealous and then killed his brother which of course was sin. Why was Cain's gift not acceptable to God?