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History will reveal what Revelation has said would happen. We need not be too worried but instead lean on Christ and walk in step with the Holy Spirit. This is enduring to the end.
Gerald, Richard, and Chris have given you good scripturally based answers.
I would just reiterate that, just as Jesus promised He would never leave or forsake those who are His, so to it is with the Father and the Spirit, because of the oneness of the Godhead in their unity, we cannot have one with out the others in us. So, the Spirit will never leave us nor forsake us either. Mt. 28:20; Heb. 15:5-6; Jn. 1416-18. Jesus does not leave us comfortless because the Holy Spirit is always in us. He is our guarantee, deposit, and surety of God's faithfulness to His commitment to save us to the uttermost. Eph. 1:14 He will bring us to completion in Christ through sanctification.
To be BORN again is to be baptised in the Holy Spurit and " sealed" . But even as a new born baby has life it still needs to be filled with the breath of life so to speak to live that life .
So likewise when we are born again we need to be ( continually) filled . " Be ye filled with the Holy Spirit "
A once filling dors not mean you often need to be refilled . The Apostles were filled on that day but after they had been arrested ,beaten and forbidden to preach in that name again they " went back to their own company " and related what had happened and once again they were all filled with the HolySpirit . So they could once again go out and preach with boldness .
If we are not born again people "do always resist the Holy Spirit" . But once you are born again you can grieve Him by a loose tongue or bad attitude or actions . And we can quench Him when He gives us prompts to do this or that good thing and we don't do it . I suppose also if we get very stubborn and dig our heels in we also quench the Spirit .
He can then leave us feeling bereft of His presence in truth He has stepped back or in the hinder part of our boat as it were . We are not being led by Him as directly as we should .
The eternal resting place of the Holy Spirit is the Word of God . When Jesus was baptised the Holy Spirit in the form of a dove tested upon Him .Consider Noah who sent out a dove .The first time it found no place if rest and returned . When he sent it out again it returned with an emblem of its resting place . In the OT the Spirit came upon people but did not rest upon them or rather in them for the Blood had not yet been shed . But after Calvary and the Blood of Christ had been accepted by the Father then was the Holy Spirit able to abide in us forever
Given the above comment I cannot add much except to say that we need to test ourselves to see if we are in the faith. This involves an impartial life review as it were; or else the danger is that we have seen evidence of His grace around us but haven't recieved it ourselves. Godly sorrow leads to repentance; worldly sorrow ultimately doesn't do any eternal good for our soul and leads to death (even Judas Iscariot was sorry that what he called a "righteous man" was killed because of his complicity and involvement in the arrest).
The Spirit contends with the flesh; a true believer therefore can never be content living in sin; or a lifestyle therein.
Feelings therefore cannot be our barometer; although we cannot ignore true guilt. The enemy will accuse us when we sin and convince us the blood isn't sufficient for atonement; and also he will use others to put false guilt and such when we try to stick to scriptural convictions on things; as I am unfortunately dealing with at present.
Hope that helps a bit; gitta go to work now.
RIch P
The last line "Without the mind of Christ leading you life, what you say about is as good as a museum piece."
should be read as
" Without the mind of Christ leading you life, what you say about faith is as good as a museum piece"...
Here we shall take the tower of Babel in order to understand what is wrong with Bible hermeneutics. For both Jews and Christians throughout their histories, the primary purpose of hermeneutics, and of the exegetical methods employed in interpretation, has been to discover the truths and values expressed in the Bible. Still the division exists in their approach. The reason shall explain precisely why Bh is the devil's nostrum.
We shall try each school of thought to set the tower in context. "And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them thoroughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime had they for morter." Literal approach by Luther and Calvin would reason the easy availability of material as number one reason. Faith alone makes the builders act as one. Their aim to reach heavens is an ideal the church should strive for. Yet they miss the point. Faith of each builder is not one as one would suppose. The plumb-line is held by God. "Except the Lord build the house, they labour in vain that build it"(Ps.127.1)
Let us try the Allegorical interpretation, favoured by Origen et al. The builders began with miry clay which is where the king's statue (Dan.2) stood. As the three kings of the east saw the star and followed it. They came to Bethlehem, the house of bread, instead. They failed because their aim was to get a name for themselves.Their interpretation is similar to moral interpretation,which seeks to establish exegetical principles by whichethicallessons may be drawn from the various parts of the Bible. There is another anagogical interpretation. For them the present fiasco of UN where nations may want to hold Israel for their war crimes but the devil is right in the UNSC and the tower of Babel was a pointer to the end times. It is thus the devil has tricked man in the post-diluvian world. Without the mind of Christ leading you life, what you say about is as good as a museum piece..
The gates of Hell not prevailing against the church means that the church attacks and satan defends. But he can not resist. The church conquers his castle. Jesus' Blood conquers sin. Life conquers death. GBU.
Often christian teachers resemble the course of Israelites from Egypt to the promised land with the course of a christian from the slavery of the satan to Heaven. Because they both look alike very much. No they are not the same but they do look alike a lot in some things. Even Paul does that in 1 Cor 10:1-11 trying to warn christians to avoid doing some things. It is not a bad thing to do. It doesn't lead to any sort of heresy I think.
Have a blessed week.
I also believe that what is needed to be revealed by God to us has already been revealed since the very begginning. There is nothing more to be revealed. So now it is a matter of interpretation by us.
But there is one thing left. And this is the events in Revelation. I believe that they are written in such a way that as we come closer to that time things become more and more clear. We combine the events of our lives with what is written and interprete accordingly. That is why I personally do not read it very often. One can not really know what those symbolisms mean. We are just guessing. Sometimes we get it right, but sometimes we end up miles away.
Have a blessed week.
v.1 " Now these are the generations of the sons of Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth: and unto them were sons born after the flood."
There are only two lists of generations with which the book of Genesis begins. It is set in context of the earth which was without form and void. It refers to a world unseen. "Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.." The will of God is a world unseen and it is made to appear. The caveat placed therein is this what is seen is not exactly what you may suppose. Bible heremeneutics merely a trick you play with your rational faculties. In Jesus Christ was life, the light of men. So God divides the light from darkness. "And God saw the light, that it was good."(1.4) This process of separating the good from darkness we find, in this verse,"and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters."(1.2) In first nine chapters we were shown the generations of Adam and of Noah. Noah was found righteous because of faith. His world framed by the word of God gives him a form so he is part of the form the earth is shaping into. His inheritance was in the light for no other reason that he put on the mind of Christ and faith was in his life. "In thy light we see the light.Ps.36.9) His life showed how the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters and literally too!
Total age of 900+50 tells us that life in faith sets Christ abiding in man.
Now the earth is divided with the generations of the sons of Noah. You see generations of darkness is very much on the rise as well." By these were the isles of the Gentiles divided in their lands; every one after his tongue, after their families, in their nations."(10.5, 20, 31) Compare this line with 11.1 This pure speech is faith. Thus a world framed by the word and tares growing side by side explains the narrative. Mt.1.1
vv.28-29 "And Noah lived after the flood three hundred and fifty years./ And all the days of Noah were nine hundred and fifty years: and he died."
Firstly God blessed Noah and his sons before they disembarked so the Covenant preserved their volume both heavenly blessings and faith which held both heaven and earth as one. Noah died in faith. "Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them." Rest from the labour. was when Noah entered into the ark, the volume stretching from heaven to the earth as the world inherited by Noah. They key was his faith so he did 'According to all that God commanded him, so did he."(Gen.6.22).
This is his inheritance as a child in light. If it is with Noah so with every hero of faith. In order to illustrate this we have God blessing Abraham and it begins from heaven to the eartn,"Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:"(15.18) This great river is in heaven! It is heavenly river associated with four angels.(Rev.9.14-15) In order to set this in concrete terms the Spirit sets the tag of 50 years in v.29 The Land is mine so only God has the authority to apportion it So the same Law of Jubilee year is applied.Both Father and Son working with the word gave us 144; similarly in terms of inheritance it is worked out thus: 7x7+1 The numeral one indicates Jesus Christ,.the author and finisher of our faith. For this reason heresy is to twist the word of God to say millennial reign is on the earth.
The Spirit gives us an earlier hint:"And Noah was five hundred years old: and Noah begat Shem, Ham, and Japheth."(5.32) Soul is tagged by five and applying this to v.29 it is plain as to what the Spirit is aiming at. We have a volume, an envelope framing our walk on the earth. Heart is that spiritual space our altar Ps.26.6
"The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD."
Hosea 2:18
"And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, and with the fowls of heaven, and with the creeping things of the ground: and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth, and will make them to lie down safely."
Hosea 2:23
"And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God."
Blessings
It is however true, that if a believer should succumb to the enemy's temptations and does not take remedial action as the Holy Spirit directs, then there will be loss. Not a loss of the Holy Spirit or salvation, but the loss of sweet communion, maybe of some degree of estrangement if sin is allowed to persist, and of the Spirit's intervention by way of warning or discipline. Or the Spirit might even allow that erring soul to taste the depravity of his/her sin, so that they may come to their senses, repent, and be restored; the story of the prodigal son is a good example of a poor choice made and yet, of a waiting loving father who is ready to forgive, receive, and restore ( Luke 15:11-32).
Just a few verses to consider (and there are many more): John 10:26-29; Romans 8:33-39; Ephesians 1:13,14; Ephesians 2:8-10; Philippians 1:6; 1 Peter 1:3-5; Jude 1:24,25.
This is why we often read of the apostles encouraging believers to be on guard against the enemy of our souls, of sin creeping into the life, and not being involved in anything that even smells of sin; Why? Not for salvation's loss, but for suffering under God's Hand of discipline and the pain of estrangement from God.
Why should we entertain anything that breaks our special love relationship with our God & Savior & bring on ourselves sorrow upon sorrow? The Holy Spirit will always alert us when we err and will always bring us back, so salvation cannot be lost. But for those who feel no sorrow or estrangement when they stray, they do not have the Holy Spirit within them and are not saved. But while they have breath, there remains hope if they draw near to God, He will draw near to them. GBU.
Just quickly to your other questions: I feel the Promised Land would equate to the rest we, as believers in Christ, have in Him. We will experience tribulations and temptations, just as Israel did when physically in their Canaan, but it was their own God-given possession and rest from their bondage, struggles, & their enemies ( Deuteronomy 12:9,10). So, I don't equate the Promised Land with Heaven, for we still have our enemies, within & without, to fight & conquer.
Romans 8:37. Through everything that life or Satan might throw at us, if Jesus by His Spirit is reigning in us, we will, through Him, be victorious in every circumstance we face. It's never easy traveling down struggle street, but when our eyes turn to Jesus & not our circumstances, we find victory; and greater victory than a human conqueror may or may not gain, returning from battle; for the victory for those in Christ is certain, continually, through Christ alone.
Matthew 16:18. True, gates can be considered the weakest part of a fortified city, but it is through those gates that the troops issue forth to battle. Those symbolic gates of Hell are opened allowing destructive deceiving spirits to wreak havoc on humans, particularly against Christ's Church. But the true and faithful Church will stand strong against those evil forces, by attending wholly to God's Word and abundant Life in the Spirit, so evil cannot gain a foothold & will leave defeated. But they will return for sure - the Church must ever remain on guard, "for we are not ignorant of his devices". GBU.
Of course these two Scriptures are very true. Therefore, I sincerely do attempt to speak in my postings in a way that brings glory to God and hope to add to the understanding of others. I so read what others post and desire to gain understanding as to the points they are desiring to make. This is important to me to do so. Sometimes I agree with others and other times not. I don't think any of us possess completely accurate understandings of Scriptures and having dialogues are helpful for all involved.
Let me add that I do appreciate that you continue to post Scripture. It is important for all of us to read, hear, speak, and write out what Scripture says. It helps us hide it in our hearts for the Spirit to use to train us up in faith, doctrine, and knowledge of our Lord, Jesus Christ.
I do wish that you may consider making some comments when you post Scriptures so those who read your post can get a better understanding of why you chose the particular verses you post. This helps us to get to know one another and to develop good relationships with one another which are valuable.
Be blessed tonight and always. We have an awesome, amazing, great God who chose us in Him first before we ever considered choosing Him. Thankfully!
The problem with written messages is that the tone meaning and objectives can be misunderstood . I much prefer talking face to face because such misunderstandings can be nipped in the bud. Or corrected if badly expressed .
So having said that my apologies for any misunderstanding . I too was raised up and since converted for most of my life thiught only in terms of 40 years . I think it was one of those great hymns sung a few rimes that caught my attention as to what it was saying which did not make sense with the light of scripture . The actual time I had calculated adding up all the times mentioned was 2 1/2 years or so . Others have put in that they were at Sinai for a year ,I thought it was 3 months so I'm going to have to check again . But I don't think the overall figure changes much .
When I said the church has made the 40 years the Christian norm . I still think so . But it is the grace of God that I understood that ,not for my or any condemnation but that we might think again and " consider our ways" . Paul said they entered not in "because of unbelief " so we can't be too easy on ourselves . For clearly we have bern blindsided by the devil and been robbed for a very long time .
For if the promised land is not heaven what is it?
That's fir another discussion . But here is another thiught.
What is " More than a conqueror.? Through Jesus Christ .
And another " " ye young men the Word of God dwelleth in you richly and yiu have overcome the wicked one" Now there is a promise! And what about " I will build my church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it" nearly all my adult life that verse has been presented as the church will withstand all the forces of hell etc.
But gates do not attack anything . They are the weakest part of a city wall and thus the most heavily defended .
I don't yet understand all it means but it does NOT mean the church is on the back foot and withstanding the powers of hell . But rather the reverse
James 1:26
If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.
Matthew 12:36
"But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment."
Blessings
And yes, given that the total number of Israelites traveling would have numbered up to two million (over 600,000 able-bodied men: Numbers 1:45,46, plus women and children), what could have been a much shorter journey in time, would have extended out much further.
I shared with Gerald about the understanding, or misunderstanding, about the 'forty years' it took them to enter Canaan. Well, a little more than forty years as we include their initial travel from Egypt. GBU.
Pt. 3
I do not think the NJ is a physical dwelling, but a symbolic representation of spiritual realities. Since it describes it as a bride and wearing clothing and such it is obviously a symbolic vision.
But this does not rule out a physical paradise like Eden or physical homes fit for us to live in that Jesus will provide for us for to live in for eternity. Since we will resurrect in physical bodies that are immortal, the earth will most likely be the perfect and most suitable place for us to live out eternity. We will still do many of the things our physical body does as Jesus' resurrected body did-eating, fellowshipping, walking, etc. We will have plenty to do, I believe. Not as ethereal spirits floating around God's throne as many depict our eternal existence. We will be a people of God and therefore have relationships with each other and most likely collaborative work to do in God's eternal kingdom.
Pt. 2
There is no need for the other parts and furnishings of the temple/tabernacle because there will no longer be any sacrifices made for sin, nor physical priestly offerings, the old has passed away and our continual, sinless relating with God will be pleasing to Him. Our praises and singing will glorify Him forever and our love from Him and one another will be in accordance with the perfect commands Jesus gave us to sum up God's will for us.
The New Jerusalem will be gloriously shining and transparent in many ways to symbolize our new sinless and pure life through and through to be like that of Jesus' life.
I do believe that this New Jerusalem is highly symbolic of realities that are not physical. But as to Jesus preparing a place for us, He may have meant this spiritual reality depicted as many rooms in His Father's house.
But most likely there is a both a spiritual and a physical reality to what Jesus promised. And if there is a physical, I do not think it is the New Jerusalem as the vision described. More likely Jesus will provide both a paradisal environment as in Eden yet differing in that God's heavenly throne (His dominion, power, authority and right to rule over the body of Christ and new creation) will no longer be separated from the earth as in the beginning. He will always be "God with us".
I don't think we can really know what the physical dwelling might be that Jesus promised. Could be our resurrected physical bodies now glorified as we would be changed and clothed with immortality and righteousness forever. And/or it could be that Jesus brings to the New Earth ready made physical dwellings for believers to dwell in throughout the new heavens and new earth in a terrestial way. It could be that Jesus will bring the blueprint and give us the skills to build for ourselves a fit physical home, community, as well as a society that is built on heavenly immutable principles. Such a physical dwelling will not look like the NJ. see Pt. 3
The Seven feast is a very interesting study!
The Hebrews called the feasts of Israel "the Appointed Times,"
Each feast has a prophetic role and a pattern for ourunderstanding.
Not only are the feasts prophetic, but each gets fulfilled at its appointed time on the very day it is observed.
The first three feasts are in the spring; the Passover Feast, the Feast of Unleavened Bread, and the Feast of Firstfruits.
They all occur in the first month of the religious year, Nisan. Shavuot,
The Feast of Weeks, is celebrated 50 days after the Feast of Firstfruits.
The first three are associated with the First Coming of Jesus Christ.
The last three, with His Second Coming.
The remaining feast, in between is prophetic of the Church.
This appears to have been fulfilled with the "birth" of the Church on the day the Feast of Pentecost was being celebrated in Acts Chapter 2.
Also.
The Feast of Pentecost is the only feast which uses leavened bread!
Leaven is a type, or Levitical symbol, for sin!
Some say that it is a prophetic anticipation of the false doctrine and tares in the Church and some say it is a prophetic anticipation of the doors opening up to the Gentiles.
Either way this is a very relevant study for a deeper understanding of much of scripture.
Blessings
If you look up what the difference between discussion and debate are you will find that debate is usually a more formal situation where those with opposing views prepare their defense of their own view and also counterarguments against what the opponent brings to the debate. In formal debates often there is designated one who wins the debate.
In informal debates, people still present their views and others bring their own proof of a contrary viewpoint. It can be a friendly discussion or aggressive.
A discussion or dialogue should have a distinctly different tone than a debate where people are attempting to change the point of view of the person who's view does not agree with one's own view. In a discussion, we should try to be more generous to one another, not trying to convince another so much as present a differing viewpoint on Scripture. It is not always easy to be gracious but we do need to be honest and try to explain our own view with precise language and Scriptural support. And we may strongly disagree on the matters involved in a topic but we should not engage in defamation of the other in a discussion. But we can point out where someone is inconsistent in presenting their view or in need of exhortation (which is never fun to do but at times what the Holy Spirit wants of us.
Going on to the other point of your post, Jesus did say that He was going to heaven to prepare a place for the disciples and believers. I believe it is the New Heaven ad New Earth primarily, but also a dwelling for us on this heaven/earth merger where God is always with us and in us and we with Him and in us, we will ever have direct access to God as the New Jerusalem is figuratively the Holy of Holies of the heavenly temple that Moses was tasked to pattern the tabernacle after. The Holy of Holies is the only part of the temple/tabernacle that is described as a perfect cube as the New Jerusalem is also described.
See pt. 2