Discuss John 15 Page 4

  • VALMAR on John 15 - 2 years ago
    One of the most discussed topics in Christendom is the idea of eternal salvation. Many noted Christian leaders in our day support the notion of eternal salvation that is not derived from scripture. God doesn't have a number of spiritual states one can be in and still serve Him. Some do try and 'straddle the fence', so to speak. Jesus plainly states in Revelation 3:15-16 that anyone considering themselves Christians and not do those things Christ commanded, have no part in His inheritance or kingdom. I note that in that same chapter of Revelation, He states in His message to the Sardis church of believers (mind you) that they who overcome, meaning obeying Him despite obstacles, sufferings or inconveniences, He will not blot their name out of the book of life. When an individual comes to Christ, that doesn't negate his or her ability to choose whether to continue in His service. Your free moral agency or freedom to choose is still there. Don't think so, consider King Saul. In 1 Samuel 10:9-11, God gives Saul a new heart and His spirit is given to him. Then in chapter 16 and verse 14, we read that God took His spirit away from Saul or departed from him. Why? DISOBEDIENCE, plain and simple. The apostle Paul had the same problem when Demas departed from him ( 2 Tim. 4:10) because of his love of this present world. Christ had a number of followers who departed from Him and followed Him no more ( John 6:66). Jesus cannot be anyone's Savior unless He's their Lord also.
  • Biblepreacher12 - 2 years ago
    Love is the bond of perfection according to Col 3:14. This is where Christianity of the hour falls short of perfection, as they believe they can not be perfect because the serpent preacher behind the pulpit isn't. The same serpent that deceived Eve has deceived Christians by using vain deceit, philosophy, theology, out-of-context verses, misconceptions, and lies.

    Without the live of the truth mankind do know know what the love of God in Christ is about 100% conditional love. Everybody claims to know God and love him, however, does God know you in Christ? The preacher preaches God loves you when it is nothing but idle words to occupy their pews every Sunday just vain deceit, vain words to get at your pocketbook and not for the saving of the soul. Without Jesus Christ the Son of God and his words in you there is no love in a man or woman as Jesus' words are spirit and life John 6:63. The preacher who preaches God is love does not themselves have a stitch of that love. The live they posess is the live of money the root of all evil, the live for your pocketbook and nothing for the saving of your soul. Sunday school is not that love of the truth. It is every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God spoken by the Son of God Jesus Christ the law of spirit and life the words of spirit and life which sents us free from the law of sin and death.

    Being a sinner is not God's love. God's live is that he washed us from all sin through the blood words of Jesus John 15:3 and Rev 1:5. In order to have something you must first posess it. In order to have love you must first posess it. No truth = no love.

    2nd Thess 2:10] And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

    [11] And for this cause God shall send them strong deluson, that they should believe a lie:

    [12] That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
  • GiGi - In Reply on John 13 - 2 years ago
    Jess L.

    PT. 2

    To wrap up. In John 15:26, Jesus says, "But when the Comforter (the Holy Spirit) is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of Truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me."

    Here we see how the "offices" of the Godhead work in unity, Jesus ask of the Father, to send the Holy Spirit to be given unto His disciples, and the Father wills to do this, the Spirit, who proceeds from the Father, is not independent of the Godhead) has the office of testifying of and about Jesus. Jesus and the Holy Spirit are given to us by the Father. The Father is the one who send both, Jesus asks of the Father and also send the Spirit in union with the Father. Jesus has the office of Mediator, one who goes between man and the Father, so in sending the Holy Spirit, he mediates this sending from the Father of the Spirit, and the Spirit completes the will of the Father by testifying of Jesus. All of the Godhead wills that the Spirit will come and dwell within believers and when the Spirit does this, all persons of the Godhead indwell a believer. It is all, really, one act of God carried out by all three persons.

    I hope that this is helpful. It is important to distinguish between the Essence of God, His Divine Being, and the distinction of the Persons of this one Divine Being. Then we can understand how Jesus can be one with the Father and also for the Father to be greater than Jesus.
  • Bennymkje - 2 years ago
    Ge.37:12-20 (2 of 2)

    "On his father's errand"

    The logos aspect of Jesus Christ was there in bodily form as Joseph was in Dothan. 'Joseph went after his brethren and found them in Dostan.' By setting parallel account of Joseph and Jesus we are given a ringside view of the effect of Law of Moses on the nation. As soon as his brethren set eyes afar off what was their reaction. "Come now therefore, and let us slay him.". They hated his dreams as much as they hated his person. Jesus well knew his presence had left them with no cloak to hide. "I know that you are Abraham's descendants, but you seek to kill Me, because My word has no place in you."( John 8:37-NKJV) "If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin."( John 15:22)

    In addition to this parallel narrative the Spirit serves another symbol as dreams of Joseph convey the role of the world of the Spirit. We carry while abiding in Christ the body of Christ as was prepared before the worlds began. This is faith in quintessence. By abiding as branches our works are what our lives show. Envy, rancor and divisions as we see that the activism of modern churches causes are not from God. Nation of Israel had no cloak to hide when Jesus came among them. Their conspiracy finds parallel to what faced Joseph in Dostan.

    What is the significance of Dostan? It was where God heard the prayer of Elisha. "Open his eyes,Lord, so that he may see." Then theLordopened the servant's eyes, "(2 Ki.6:17).

    Joseph was there at the mercy of his brethren. The Spirit uses the name to evoke that there was no way they could escape their heinous crime from retribution. Joseph's story is a commentary as the fate of Israel after they had rejected Jesus and killed him on trumped up charges. The word of God 'shall prosper in thing whereto I sent it.'
  • Jordyn - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Shabbat Keeper:

    I know the two resurrection you speak of, most believe what you believe.

    The word speaks of Christ resurrection, then the resurrection of those who never believe that were raised with Christ.

    Colossians 3:1 ... if ye be RISEN with Christ ....

    Ephesians 2:6 .... and hath RAISED US us up together ....

    Isaiah 26:19 .... TOGETHER with my dead body shall they ARISE ....

    Hosea 6:2 ..... in the third day he will raise US UP .......

    The saints that arose with Christ, were the Old Testament saints that had died in faith, but had never receive their promise of eternal life.

    Those: in Revelation under the alter clothed in white are the Old saints awaiting their promise, eternal life, by their resurrection of Christ.

    These are the 144,000 raised with Christ, the firstfruits of the resurrection.

    Hebrews 11:39 And these all, havlng obtained a good report through faith, received not the PROMISE (eternal life).

    Hebrews 11:40 Christ having provided some BETTER THING FOR US (never having to die and wait in the grave), that they WITHOUT US should not be made PERFECT (by our resurrection as one).

    Hebrews 5:9 ...and having been made perfect .... by our resurrection as one ....

    Philippians 3:15 Let us therefore who be perfect (by our resurrection as one), be thus minded: and if in any thing you be otherwise mined, God shall reveal even this to you.

    God Bless YOU!
  • Shabbat Keeper - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Hi Jordyn, the two resurrections that I was referring to are :

    1. the resurrection of the dead at the second coming of Jesus Christ.

    2. And, then 1000 years later, the resurrection of the wicked to receive their judgement.

    I was not referring to the resurrection of our LORD which, in my opinion, is a special and separate deal. By the way, it's so interesting because after Christ rose, some of the dead were resurrected and seen in Jerusalem. The Bible says Jesus took captives in his train when he returned to Heaven. That's exciting. I wish it would've been me in the train. Oh well. I'll be patient. :)
  • Jordyn - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Shabbat Keeper:

    Your right, there are two resurrections.

    The first RESURRECTION .... is the resurrection of Christ .... and those that come to the truth of the gospel THAT YOU were joint heirs of that resurrection, and made ONE, were married to Christ, were baptised in HIS NAME.

    The whole Bible is the promise of God to destroy death.

    The promise has always been ETERNAL LIFE.

    The wages of SIN (unbelief) has always been DEATH.

    All this was accomplished when Christ was resurrected.

    When you come to truth that YOU and Christ were resurrected TOGETHER, then you will never die again.

    That is the FIRST DEATH and the FIRST RESURRECTION.

    Luke 20:36 Neither can they (YOU) die anymore, for they (YOU) are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, BEING the children of THE RESURRECTION.

    God BLESS YOU!
  • Shabbat Keeper - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Hello Jordyn,

    The RIGHTEOUS dead are raised at the FIRST resurrection to eternal life. The UNRIGHTEOUSNESS dead are raised at the SECOND resurrection. They will face the judgement seat of Christ and then they will die eternally. Their soul will die.

    Below, verse 24 emphasizes that 'once saved, always saved' is a dangerous lie. How many children were saved in Sunday school and assume, as adults ,they are saved. But, they don't give one thought to God as an adult and they do not pursue sanctification in their life. Anyway, the following scripture is from Ezekiel:

    "The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

    But, if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes and do that which is right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

    All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.

    Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? Saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?

    But when the righteous turn away from his righteousness, and committed iniquity, and does according to all the abominations that the wicked man does, shall he live? All his righteousness that he has done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he has trespassed, and in his sin that he has sinned, in them shall he die." Ezekiel 18:20-24
  • Jordyn - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Shabbat Keeper:

    You said one can lose their salvation.

    What are you saved from?

    Your SAVED from DEATH.

    Christ is our PASSOVER sacrifice, death passed over us,

    If we don't believe, then we die in our SIN of UNBELIEF.

    But as you said, Christ is going to resurrect the DEAD, so one cannot lose his salvation, being saved from death.

    God Bless YOU!
  • Shabbat Keeper - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Yes , scripture states that salvation can be lost.

    See Ezekiel 18:21-32.

    However, the lost won't be eternally conscious in hell. God says they will surely die. Cease to exist. It's too hard to explain in a couple paragraphs. But, eternal life is only the reward of the righteous.

    Also, when people die, they fall asleep until judgement day. We have an object lesson in our nightly sleep. Suddenly, it's morning. The idea of grandma watching over us from heaven is a satanic ploy. It makes room for seances, praying to dead saints, spiritism. Any dead relative appearing to a living relative is a demon impersonating the relative.
  • DrCharlesSaw - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Amen! More blessings to you!
  • S Spencer - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Amen DrCharlesSaw.

    By the way, welcome to the site.

    We live in such critical times where we see less planting and watering today. After we plant God gives the increase.

    There has to be a seed planted before the watering and then God gives the increase. There we have a new birth!!

    The role of the Holyspirit is the most neglected aspect of the Godhead! It's he that teaches us.

    For ourselves the word of God is a must for our growth.

    This forum and any other platform is an opportunity to witness.

    Thanks and God bless.
  • Jordyn - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Brother CharlesSaw:

    The problem with the question of eternal security lies in having NO KNOWLEDGE of God's WORD.

    If one deeply studies the PROPHECIES, one will see that at some point in the ages to come all the tribes of Israel are going to once again exit.

    BUT, in this AGE he is ONLY calling out the PREISTHOOD, the house of David, the kind of firstfruits as is the tribe of Judah, lawgivers that will rule and reign and serve him when he resurrects all the DEAD back to there bodies of flesh and blood.

    If one studies under the spirit of truth, you find these prophecies in the blessings of Israel to his twelve sons, from the beginning the tribe of Judah was CHOSEN to be God's lawgiver. The blessing on the remaining tribes will be fulfilled after all the lawgivers are put in place.

    Isaiah, Ezekiel, Zachariah, and Revelation all prophesy ONLY a PART will be save in this age, one third (probably symbolic) since other prophecies seem to say ONE TENTH, the tithe to God, those without blemish being sacrificed with Christ on HIS CROSS.

    You find this in the blessings of Jacob and Esau.

    Hebrews 11:20 By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau CONCERNING THINGS TO COME.

    There are TWO DEATHS, TWO RESURRECTION and TWO JUDGEMENTS,

    The first death and resurrection is those SAVED in this AGE, the ones Christ CAUSES TO BELIEVE in this AGE, they are being judged by the words of God.

    1 Timothy 4:10 ... who is the SAVIOUR of ALL MEN (not necessarily in this AGE), especially THOSE (in this AGE) that BELIEVE.

    Isaiah 6:13 But yet in it (the land) shall be a tenth, and it (the tenth) shall be eaten (same as Christ is eaten, eat the words and digest them) as a teil tree, and as an oak, whose substance (CHRIST) IS IN THEM, when they cast their leaves (administer judgement), so the HOLY SEED shall be the substance thereof.

    Obadiah 1:21 And SAVIOURS (those conformed to the image of Christ) SHALL COME upon Mt, Zion to JUDGE the house of ESAU

    and the Kingdom shall be the LORDS.
  • DrCharlesSaw - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Thanks for your reply. While I agree that we should focus on winning souls, I also believe that it is crucial for the church to teach the sound doctrine as Paul commanded to Timothy.

    Besides, this is the "discussion" section, not the comment section. Everyone is welcome to express their views and opinions about a specific verse.

    I am an advocate for winning souls to Christ, and I have been doing so for the past 14 years. Let's keep the momentum and win more souls for the Kingdom.

    Blessings to you!
  • S Spencer - In Reply on John 15 - 2 years ago
    Hi Dr CharlesSaw.

    Rather search for a debate to win on this topic eternal security, Let's join in bringing people to Christ and give them the Gospel that saves!

    If you can lose it, you have to first get it.

    There's many that will be deceived that's on both sides of that argument.

    That's one of the problems with the Church today, There's a lack of preaching the Gospel and a great interest in debating.

    Why not tell someone how to be saved and let them come to their own mind whether they can lose it.

    God bless.
  • DrCharlesSaw on John 15 - 2 years ago
    SALVATION CAN BE LOST

    John 15:2: "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit."

    I heard so many people saying that salvation cannot be lost. I think there is a necessity to define what "lost" means. Does it mean losing the communion with the Lord on this earth? Or does it mean going to hell after death? In my argument, I have chosen the latter definition, losing salvation = going to hell after death. If one finishes up not making it to heaven, it means the person has lost his salvation because the goal of salvation is to live where Jesus is ( John 14:3)

    1. Who are the branches Jesus spoke about? The believers, here Jesus was not talking about non-believers (because they are not "branches").

    2. Two types of branches: Branches that abide in Jesus, and branches that do not abide in Him, meaning believers who abide in Jesus, and believers who do not. Those who abide bear good fruit, but those who do not abide bear no fruit.

    3. Note that there is a difference between accepting Jesus and abiding in Him. Some people accept Jesus but do not ABIDE in Him, meaning that they do not obey and completely surrender to Him in their journey.

    4. Those people (who believed at first, but did not abide in Him later) are the branches that do not abide in Jesus, and therefore, they will be cut off.

    Conclusion: It is a big mistake to believe that one cannot lose salvation once saved. Philippians 2:12-13 said, "Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you..." If salvation is "granted" once, why did the Apostle Paul say we should work with "fear" and "trembling"?

    I Corinthians 9:27: "But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway." Look at the last word of the verse. "CASTAWAY", meaning losing salvation.

    Brethren, Let's walk in holiness.
  • SolaScrip - In Reply - 2 years ago
    "Bro dan - in Reply

    SolaScrip,

    True Christ Followers will be obedient to all of God's 10 Commandments as taught by Jesus in the New Testament."

    Well, God's 10 Commandments are identical to Christ's Commandments. Christ didn't change, minimize or abbreviate them in any way. Christ is the Creator of all things and He created the Commandments - there would be no reason for Him to change or rescind any of them.

    Christ speaks of obeying the Law, the 10 Commandments, just as they are taught by the scribes and Pharisees in Matt. 23:1-3. He says to "do as they say, but not as they do" because the teachers of the Law at that time were all hypocrites. They taught the 10 Commandments, but kept none of them. That passage proves that Jesus taught the literal keeping of the 10 Commandments, not just the essence, or spirit, of them in our hearts, etc.

    Jesus stated, as you pointed out, that He kept all of the Father's 10 Commandments physically when He declared it in John 15:10.

    We see that 1 John makes clear that we are to live as Jesus lived, obeying what He obeyed, in 1 John 2:6. That does not support the modern popular teaching that we are only to obey them in spirit. And if Jesus had any intention of teaching that Christians did not need to keep them literally, we would not have the record of the disciples keeping the Saturday Sabbath immediately after Christ's death on the Cross in Luke 23:54-56. We also would not see Paul being labeled by the elders as a "Keeper of the Law" in Acts 21:24.

    "IF a Christian is filled with God's Holy Spirit they will naturally be following all of God's/Jesus Commandments."

    I would agree with this, but that just means that the vast majority of professed Christians today are not filled with the Holy Spirit because most Christians do not obey the 10 Commandments.

    Jesus says that it is the keeping of the 10 Commandments that is pre-requisite for receiving 'HIM' as the Holy Spirit in John 14:21.
  • SolaScrip - In Reply - 2 years ago
    "Bro dan - in Reply

    SolaScrip,

    True Christ Followers will be obedient to all of God's 10 Commandments as taught by Jesus in the New Testament."

    Well, God's 10 Commandments are identical to Christ's Commandments. Christ didn't change, minimize or abbreviate them in any way. Christ speaks of obeying the Law, the 10 Commandments, just as they are taught by the scribes and Pharisees in Matt. 23:1-3. He says to "do as they say, but not as they do" because the teachers of the Law at that time were all hypocrites. They taught the 10 Commandments, but kept none of them. That passage proves that Jesus taught the physical keeping of the 10 Commandments, not just the essence, or spirit, of them in our hearts, etc.

    Jesus stated, as you pointed out, that He kept all of the Father's 10 Commandments physically when He declared it in John 15:10.

    We see that 1 John makes clear that we are to live as Jesus lived, obeying what He obeyed, in 1 John 2:6. That does not support the modern popular teaching that we are only to obey them in spirit. And if Jesus had any intention of teaching that Christians did not need to keep them literally, we would not have the record of the disciples keeping the Saturday Sabbath immediately after Christ's death on the Cross in Luke 23:54-56. We also would not see Paul being labeled by the elders as a "Keeper of the Law" in Acts 21:24.

    "IF a Christian is filled with God's Holy Spirit they will naturally be following all of God's/Jesus Commandments."

    I would agree with this, but that just means that the vast majority of professed Christians today are not filled with the Holy Spirit because most Christians do not obey the 10 Commandments.

    Jesus says that it is the keeping of the 10 Commandments that is pre-requisite for receiving 'HIM' as the Holy Spirit in John 14:21.
  • Bro dan - In Reply - 2 years ago
    SolaScrip,

    True Christ Followers will be obedient to all of God's 10 Commandments as taught by Jesus in the New Testament.

    Luke 9:23"And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me."

    John 14:15"If ye love me, keep my commandments."

    Keeping God's 10 Commandments - plus the additional commandment that Jesus emphasized - to Love each other.

    John 15:10 "If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love."

    Jesus warns all of us that we will not enter into Salvation without keeping God's Commandments.

    Revelation 22:14 "Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city."

    IF a Christian is filled with God's Holy Spirit they will naturally be following all of God's/Jesus Commandments.

    It's IMPOSSIBLE to live a worldly life and be a Christ follower.

    Happy Sabbath Day!
  • Ronald Whittemore - In Reply - 2 years ago
    S Spencer,

    Part two

    What does it mean to believe? What is the evidence that we believe? As Paul said, it is like running a race, when we start this race, we believe we are going to finish, and with God's Spirit we have all the determination and motivation we are not only going to finish this race we are going to win this race.

    We are saved! We are being saved! We shall be saved! When we start, are all our sins forgiven, our past, present, and our future sins the moment we accept Jesus Christ as our Savior and are baptized? Is our salvation guaranteed and we cannot lose it or fall out of grace regardless?

    We are saved. Eph. 2:5 When we accept the gospel and are baptized our sins are blotted out, Isaiah 44:22 Acts 3:19 and we become a child/son/daughter of God, John 1:12 we are justified, made righteous by the blood of Christ and the Holy Spirit dwells in us, and now we begin a relationship through God's Spirit, and God and Jesus abide in us, 2 John 1:9. This is the start of the race, the beginning of our salvation.

    We are being saved. Philippians 1:6 Hearing the Word one believes and is baptized into Christ they are made clean (justification) the work of grace, and the Lord will continue working in us until He returns if we abide in Him John 15:3-5. How does God complete his good work in us? Testing James 1:2-4, chastising Heb. 12:6-7 Our relationship. If we abide in Him, Jesus, and God abides in us. The branches bear the fruit of the vine, the vine produces the fruit not us/branch, sanctification. We are running the race Philippians 2:12

    We shall be saved. Redemption and glorification. Our full salvation comes at the end, when Jesus returns. Luke 21:28 "being now justified" We started the race. We are being saved, "being reconciled" we are running the race, 2 Cor. 5:18. We shall be saved at the end of the race. Romans 13:11.

    See part three.
  • S Spencer - In Reply - 2 years ago
    Ronald.

    Part 4.

    PENTECOST.

    This is the beginning of the Christ church, and the Gospel first went out to the Jews, Peter was talking to the local crowd. "ALL Jews" Acts 2:5 "And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. Also Acts 2:22 and Acts 2:36.

    They were celebrating Shavuot-the Feast of Weeks-also known as Hag Ha Katzir, the Feast of Harvest, and known to most of us as the Feast of Pentecost. It is worthy to note that this feast was also one of three which was important for every able-bodied male to attend in Jerusalem.

    Peter was letting them know that they crucified their king and Messiah.

    Then in Acts 2:37 it's important to notice their reaction and what they asked; (Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, WHAT SHALL WE DO?)

    In verse 38 Peter answers them; Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    This repentance was to turn from Judaism and be Identified with Christ.

    They were pricked in their hearts shows a stone lifted that they stumbled over. Their baptism was their profession of faith. They were baptized by the Holyspirit during this process.

    John 10:7-10 you see the Lord is calling the Jews out of Judaism.

    In John 15:1 Jesus says I am the TRUE vine or "Genuine" vine. This is contrary to Israel being the degenerate vine seen in Jeremiah 2:21. John the Baptist came to Prepare the way for Lord, John's baptism was a baptism of repentance. This transition period went on throughout the early church.

    They were to turn from Judaism and believe on Christ as mentioned in John 6:29.

    Peter and the rest of the disciples was told to go Jerusalem to wait on power from on high. When they received that power, they begun to do the work of God.

    See Part 5.
  • Richard H Priday - 2 years ago
    God's attributes: Beauty

    The beauty of the cross is perhaps no better described than in Isaiah 52:14. His appearance or "visage" was so marred from the beatings and other injuries before the crucifixion that Jesus was hardly recognizable as a man. But by His stripes; we are healed ( Isaiah 53:5 just a few verses later). He has brought us beauty from ashes ( Isaiah 61:3) which in context means Israel will have restitution after suffering judgment. But God in the flesh resulted not in admiration but in a man of sorrows acquainted with grief ( Isaiah 53:3).

    God's awe inspiring attributes are seen in the visions of the Lord as seen by Isaiah 6; Ezekiel 1:22 and associated verses in Revelation 15:2; etal; and Daniel 10:6; etal). The true beauty of God; of course ties in with His selflessness; agape love and other characteristics that are above storge; Philleo and eros type of human love. Satan himself was a most beautiful creation as Lucifer ( Ezekiel 28:12) UNTIL he fell. Now the beauty is vanity as it is with any fallen creature who pride has allowed to contaminate. God Himself deserves worship and is not being arrogant in stating this desire but there are no verses I am aware of that state God is PROUD of being the God of all creation; He is supreme and in that sense better than anyone else; but He calls His followers by name and "friends" ( John 15:15). This makes Him the perfect Father.

    God created all things for His good pleasure including man ( Revelation 4:11). No doubt Adam and Eve in a sinless state were beautiful; and perhaps still externally appeared that way after the fall. All things were fearfully and wonderfully made ( Psalm 139:14) but man has sought out many inventions (see Ecclesiastes 7:29). 1 Chronicles 16:27 talks of the majesty of God which no doubt incorporates beauty as seen in the creation. This makes man without excuse; as Romans 1 and Psalm 19 make clear.

    God's beauty is more than skin deep and indescribable as all other traits.
  • Bennymkje - 2 years ago
    Ge.2:4-6 "In the day"

    "And there was not a man to till the ground./But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground"

    The Spirit is creating a spiritual space as an author does with words. However fantastical the subject matter is the author employs words as bricks and the reader suspends his disbelief in order to enter therein. The Spirit is here presenting a spiritual space. What God demands from you is no different than what you wholeheartedly give to a human author, say Dean Swift writing Gulliver's travel adventures. Does anyone pick a quarrel with him because no such kingdom of Lilliput exists? Why on earth a rational man would deny God the same benefit of doubt? Before approaching the God document the rule for a believer is simple: first know your enemy. He simply pulls wool over you lest you should know the truth and make you free of Satan the father of lies. "But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: [4] In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them."(2 Co.4:3-4)

    God blessed man (1:28) Be fruitful is part of it and subdue it is what the Son signifies. God blesses man in his Son. It is what we read in John 15:1-5 The true Vine discourse of Jesus, "And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it:" This is not what find we at present. Man claims his reason be all. If so what worth is his rational faculties without God?

    The earth abides forever because the fulness in Son creates blessedness in all things, body spirit and soul and it is what we shall examine now.
  • Oseas - In Reply - 2 years ago
    Hello Jesse

    Greetings in Christ JESUS

    Unfortunately the translation has caused centuries of a great confusion about the identification of the Holy Spirit who is not a "ghost" or "Ghost", but a person, and as a person he is the lesser among the three- John 15:26 combined with John 16:12-15.

    I must say that the person of Holy Spirit does not accept being called by this undesirable, unpleasant, inconvenient nickname, in fact such translation sounds as a mockery, it's terrible, very terrible.

    Hope that GOD forgives the author(s) of such translation that has caused great and secular confusion for centuries, I should believe that this was not the translators' intention, of course.

    This specific trnslation was/ is not good. Times ago I had a short debate about it in the site denominated "purebible".

    God bless
  • Richard H Priday - 2 years ago
    Purging our lives

    2 Timothy 2:21 shows that we can clean ourselves so that we are not just vessels of clay but can be vessels of honor. Jesus tells us that he purges branches to produce more fruit ( John 15:2). We thus face that the lost are nothing but dead branches or profane vessels but we can through sanctification work towards purification and honor. We can perhaps see this also with the parable of the sower where some have the thorns of worldly cares snuff them out. ( Mark 4:18-19). A truly saved individual will pass the test of the trials which God places to test His own (see 1 Peter 1:7).

    To succeed we need to be hidden in Christ ( Colossians 3:3) and truly be dead in Christ. Our old nature is impossible to put to death otherwise and will forever try to resurrect itself. God has put eternity into the hearts of men ( Ecclesiastes 3:11); yet that verse shows we cannot see to understand God who is basically beyond time and ourselves. Perhaps self preservation is a reflection that we are an eternal soul; thankfully God has the upper hand for those He has called and predestined will make it to glorification; and that for eternity ( Romans 8:30).

    The concept of redemption or Kinsman redeemer is seen with the story of Ruth. Christ redeemed us from among men through His atoning sacrifice ( Galatians 3:13). He purchased us with His blood. He has removed our sins as far as the east is from the west ( Psalm 103:12 also read verses 13 to 14). We have passed from death to life ( John 5:24). His Spirit bears witness with our spirit as to our salvation ( Romans 8:16).

    These and many other promises are things to meditate on and give comfort. We can only undestand such things if we are spiritually discerned; however and one of His children. ( 1 Cor. 2:14-15). Let us test ourselves to see if we are in the faith therefore ( 2 Cor. 13:5-6).

    Agape.
  • Frankie J - In Reply - 2 years ago
    Hi Ronald

    Well said,

    I would add to your statement of Paul in 1Cor 9:27

    Though Romans is place before Cor in the bible, it was actually written after Cor

    In Pauls ever increasing growth in the Grace in the Lord Jesus Christ, Grace brought him to the perfection, maturity, & confidence that he states in Rom 8:35-39

    only sin separates

    This clearly show a perfection that can be added too, as we continue steadfastly to grow in Grace until the end 2Tim 4:7

    this is the reason he states in Philippians 3:12 & then in Philippians 3:15 it was a contradiction of truths, but that he learnt

    John 15:5 & Philippians 4:13 Humility, Micah 6:8

    We have the Scriptures as a testimony of Paul's extra ordinary life, all owning to Grace, 1Cor 15:10

    God is not a respector of persons, though He does have different placement within His body, yet all are required to be holy!

    Grace & Peace to you
  • Jordyn - In Reply - 2 years ago
    Brother Richard:

    Christ has already come the second time, as a thief in the night, you don't see the thief?

    Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was once offered for the SINS of many, and to those who look for him he shall APPEAR THE SECOND TIME without SIN unto SALVATION.

    John 16:7 For I tell you the truth, it is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter WILL NOT COME unto you, but if I depart, I will sent him to you.

    John 15:26 ....but when the Comforter IS COME ....... even the SPIRIT of TRUTH ..... he will testify of me ......

    Colossians 1:27 ..... this mystery ..... Christ ON YOU ......

    God Bless YOU!
  • Ronald Whittemore - In Reply - 2 years ago
    Hi S Spencer,

    Well said brother, likewise reckon, we should think or consider and live a life as if we are dead to sin. Some take it as it is a one-time deal, and they are good to go. But is it conditional? If we are conditionally accepted there is something on our part, we must do to be accepted. Our faith, like Abraham, is that God is the only true God and He can and will reward us. We must choose to come to Him on His terms or continue in the ways of the world and if we do we will receive the gift of faith from God, His calling.

    What must we do? We are all sinners in need of God's mercy, or our sins will remain, not forgiven, blotted out, or paid for unless we come to repentance as we are commanded to, Acts 17:30. If we obey we will enter His mercy, and our sins will be blotted out, Prov.28:13 Is. 55:7 1 John 1:9 Acts 3:19. Our past sins that separated us from God, Is. 59:1-2.

    With repentance and confession, we are no longer separated from God, no longer under condemnation we enter justification, made right with God we enter the presence of the Lord, Acts 3:19. Baptized into Christ we begin a relationship through the Holy Spirit to all who obey and repent, Acts 2:38.

    To remain in justification, we must continue to follow the lead He provides through the Holy Spirit, Rom. 8:1 Rom 8:12-14. While we remain in Justification and repentance Jesus continues to cover by His blood the penalty for sins we commit, 1 John 1:7.

    Paul, we know was chosen by Jesus and he was filled with the Holy Spirit, but he said even he could be a castaway, 1 Cor. 9:25-27. Even with the seal of the earnest of the Holy Spirit, a downpayment is for what we are at that time, if we fall back, it can be forfeited if we are not willing to remain repentant. If we choose to walk by the flesh and not after the Spirit we return to condemnation and we will perish, John 15:6 the word IF, we will have to pay the penalty for sin ourselves, Rev. 21:8.

    Just my understanding.

    God bless,

    RLW
  • Bennymkje - 2 years ago
    Number 42 (2of 2)

    The Spirit gives the beast 42 months to denote that his authority came from Satan himself. So are these children. Do we not see these children of Belial hating a man for color? or for his baldness? Of what business it is for them to judge another man's servant? Children of Belial serve their master and they have another gospel and another christ. "Those who hate me without reason outnumber the hairs of my head; many are my enemies without cause, those who seek to destroy me. "(Ps.69:4) This was fulfilled in the life of Jesus Christ. "But this is to fulfill what is written in their Law: 'They hated me without reason.'( John 15:25)

    The angel talking with John refers to the temple of God to which shows a courtyard, and it falls in with his Jewish background. But the courtyard refers to the camp without where Christ suffered, "Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate."(He.13:12)

    The Children of Belial or the Gentiles by their deeds (because of resisting the gospel of Christ) shall injure the building of the church which however shall go on despite of their interference. This shall go on for 42 days.
  • Richard H Priday - 2 years ago
    The value of human life.

    Recently; I was given a survey by a pro life organization which asked me about various issues. I stated that all lives; whether born children; elderly or those in the womb should be valued. We clearly live in a suicidal culture where anything of value has been cheapened; and the value of a traditional marriage seems to have been removed as a serious concept. We face challenges from those who would terminate the life of the elderly with "assisted suicide" not just for unbearable pain but for those with various psychological issues. We see unborn life to be considered "parasites" by those in the trending values of society. No doubt the cheap thrills of drugs and the trivialization of the value of life through violent anime has blurred reality from fiction and allowed youth to have less restraint on taking another life to justify their "manifesto" or just in robbing someone of a few dollars.

    In the scripture; we know that God has no pleasure in the death of the wicked ( Ezekiel 18:23). He judges according to His standards. Deutoronomy 30:19 encourages us to choose life and that benefits our descendants as well (loosely translated). It also gives a choice for cursings or blessings. Joshua 24:15 states to choose who you will serve and later in the verse states "as for me and my house we will serve the Lord."

    More homes need this as their standard. Children clearly need care to a certain age; but there are times when unacceptable behavior and disrespect for authority may force the issue and they need to be removed until repentant. The fear of the Lord needs to be something along with respect that obviously is missing in many homes today. Proper firmness is needed and we need to show as parents that if we love God we obey His commandments. ( John 15:10; 1 John 2:3). Proper love means discipline; we cannot follow permissiveness as Proverbs 13:24 states; there are verses that say the soul is saved ( Prov. 19:18) with discipline.


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