I agree, when Jesus returns, it will not be a secret, as all the Scriptures proclaim, it will be with the sound of the trumpet, the last trumpet, 1 Corinthians 15:52, 1 Thessalonians 4:16, Revelation 11:15. As you said, every eye shall see Him coming in the clouds, Revelation 1:7, Revelation 19:11-16.
The resurrection of the righteous, which is the first resurrection, will happen at Christ's return, Revelation 19:11-16, Revelation 20:4-6. Scripture does not say Jesus goes back to heaven. 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 Paul is comforting them that those who are asleep/dead in Christ would not be left out of the return of Christ and the resurrection. Nowhere in these verses does it say we are taken to heaven.
If we read and study Scriptures with preconceived assumptions, it fogs the truth. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8 is about the return of Jesus and our gathering together unto Him on earth, at His coming. It says do not let man deceive you because Jesus will not return until two things happen. The falling away/apostasy, and the man of sin is revealed.
Revelation 19:20 is where the beast and the false prophet are cast into the lake of fire. In Revelation 17:14, they are the ones in the first resurrection who are in the battle of Armageddon with Jesus, and in Revelation 20:4 are the ones in the first resurrection who are being judged at the judgment seat of Christ, here on earth.
I understand many believe in the rapture, some say pre, mid, or post. In all three views, we are taken to heaven. I have not found any Scripture that explicitly states we are taken to heaven; it is an assumption, and it must be read where it is not written. I don't see the bride mentioned in the rapture doctrine; that's another discussion.
I see the coming of Jesus not as a secret event, but as one the world will witness. This is supported by Scripture: Matthew 24:29-31, 1 Corinthians 15:51-54, 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, and Revelation 19:11-16. This event occurs after the seventh angel sounds the last trumpet, Revelation 11:15. Then, we see the angel summoning the birds for the battle of Armageddon.
The ones in the first resurrection, Revelation 20:4-6, will be with Jesus during the battle, Revelation 17:12-14. Afterward, we observe the judgment of those in the first resurrection, Revelation 20:4.
A thought, over the past nearly 2000 years, believers in Christ, the body of Christ, the Church have faced beheading, burning at the stake, being placed on poles soaked in oil, lit as lamps along roads, among other horrible deaths. Why would the last of the Church be spared? We have been told we will face much tribulation, and if we endure, Matthew 24:9-13. The Great Tribulation and the wrath of God are not the same.
Based on my last post; many seem to think that Satan gets great glee in deceiving souls and sending them to hell. Considering that he is going there himself he may be mad enough to somehow think he can avoid his fate but anyone else being there with him I doubt gives him any consolation. We are to him most likely a means to an end to achieve a dream that is destined to fail; that is worldwide worship as the Godhead has only reserved for itself and of course the only Creator to be praised. Unlike our Lord who chastises everyone He loves; and in fact allows those angels who haven't left their first estate to observe and learn from us; nothing more constructive is or can be gained by Satan or his minions in their fallen state. Not being able to control his own fate has no doubt contributed to maniacal schemes to seize control once 2 Thessalonians 2:10 states For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
What we see from Revelation 17:16 is men (10 kings of the earth) destroying the woman on the Beast which is the false world religious system the first half of the Tribulation. This is no doubt to allow their beloved Antichrist to fulfill Satan's desire that he alone is worshipped and this facilitates their ability to have worldwide rulership for that short 3 and a half year time frame. There is much detail as to how the false religious system is a smokescreen; or a means to an end along with the parallel influence of a false prosperity for some in the worldwide economic boom as it were; which apparently extends even further the already bloated super rich class from others who are dying like flies from the plagues and poverty on the earth from the earlier seal and ensuing beginning of the Trumpet judgments. More study on this timing can be pursued later.
All who worship the Beast are NOT in the Lamb's book of life; the mark seals the deal
Revelation is difficult to discuss briefly, and I may have stumbled.
I tried to explain that Revelation isn't arranged in order like other books in the Bible, and I didn't do a good job. Jesus doesn't return until the seventh trumpet, the last trump, 1 Corinthians 15:52, Revelation 10:7.
I'm sorry, but I don't know much about Premillennialism, Amillennialism, or Postmillennialism. I haven't studied them, and I don't care for titles.
My understanding is that Jesus returns in Revelation 19:11-16, and the saints are resurrected, Matthew 24:29-31, Revelation 20:4-6.
This is when the great tribulation ends, and God's wrath is poured out, Revelation 15:7, Revelation 16:1-17.
Next comes the battle of Armageddon, Revelation 19:17-21 which those in the first resurrection will participate, Revelation 17:14. Their Judgement is shown in Revelation 20:4. The beast and the false prophet are cast into the lake of fire, and those who worshiped the beast and had the mark are either cast in then or during the white throne judgment, but their verdict was already given, Revelation 14:9-10.
Then the kingdom will be established, and there will be people left in the nations whom Satan, after he is released, will deceive.
The land of Israel will be restored, Ezekiel 11:17, Jeremiah 23:5-6, and members of the tribes of Israel that will be gathered from all the nations will inhabit that land during the 1000 years, Jeremiah 29:14. Other nations will, as seen in Zechariah 14:16-20, witness Jesus ruling with a rod of iron; there are other Scriptures about this time.
My understanding of the coming of Jesus, the first resurrection, and the gathering of saints to Him, which I see as a one-time event. I understand many may disagree, but I feel in my heart that the teaching of the rapture as a separate event may be incorrect. We must understand that in Revelation, the events recorded in the book are not a linear timeline.
Jesus returns only once, which is what Paul warns about. In 2 Timothy 2:16-18, I believe Paul is addressing the same issue he talks about in 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8. Paul says, Let no man deceive you by any means, and he is speaking about the coming of the Lord. He states that that day will not come unless there is a falling away first, meaning apostasy or a turning away from faith, and the revealing of the man of sin, the son of perdition, which signifies destruction.
Both of these events must happen before Jesus returns. Just as back then, false teachings about the timing and details of Jesus' return, as I feel the idea of a separate rapture, many are expecting something that is not going to happen, and when it becomes evident to those still here, that moment will lead to the falling away. I feel great tribulation and the wrath of God are not the same.
When Jesus returns, we observe the first resurrection, the battle of Armageddon, and the judgment of those in the first resurrection in Revelation 19:11 through Revelation 20:4-6. This judgment includes those who did not worship the beast or take his mark. This proves it is after the great tribulation. Those who fought with Jesus in this battle are the chosen and faithful, Revelation 17:14. These are the ones in the first resurrection; they will reign with Jesus on earth, not in heaven.
Thank you, brother, for this discussion that I feel is very important and will continue to study. It is up to each of us to pray in search of the truth.
I am doing my best to follow and study what you are posting, just one or two questions. I agree if you say the first resurrection is when Jesus returns to earth, in Revelation 19, is the rapture. We see in Revelation 17:14 when the Lamb overcomes the beast and the 10 kings/battle of Armageddon, the ones with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.
You say, "After the thousand years, we leave with Christ. And the people on the earth who are left over from the tribulation, who still are not saved, but they've been given this one-thousand-year opportunity to live under the rule of Christ with Satan bound, when Satan is let loose, we will see that they will go back to serving Satan again."
After 1000 years, where do we go if we leave with Jesus? It seems you are saying those who go through the tribulation are given 1000 years to repent, so do people not die during the 1000 years? Are there no saved during the 1000 years? Forgive me if I am misunderstanding this.
Revelation 17:12 - And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
And that's the 10-nation confederacy that is already formed. But three will be absorbed into the seven.
Revelation 17:16 - And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
Now what in the world is going on here?
The beast is only going to allow the religious system, the prophet, to ride this beast for so long. And the ten nations are going to give their allegiance to this woman. But when the antichrist is through with her, then he's going to turn against her, as well as the kings because they're going to be on his side, and she's going to be destroyed, this religious system.
Revelation 17:17 - For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.
God says this is my will. Give all of your allegiance to this woman. But God says that once my plan is fulfilled, then I'm going to turn them against her. And they will destroy her.
Revelation 17:18 - And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.
And the woman which you saw is the great city, which reigns over the kings of the earth. That's Rome, cryptic Babylon.
Revelation 18:3 - For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
Everybody's mind was intoxicated with the economic, political, and religious system of the world.
Revelation 17:9 - And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.
And here is the mind which has wisdom. The seven heads are seven hills, on which the woman sits. It's the city on seven hills. Does anybody know what it is? It is Rome. It is cryptically known as Babylon in the book of Revelation. There are other theories out there but with every other description we are given in Revelation Chapter 17, Rome fits every category.
Revelation 17:10 - And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he comes, he must continue a short time.
Now what all this means is that there are five kings that have ruled. At the time of John is the sixth. So far, Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, the Medo-Persians, and Greece have ruled. The sixth is Rome that's under the rule at the time that John was writing.
He's going to tell us in Verse 11, just to throw more confusion at us, he says that one is going to rise up, who is the seventh, and will become the eighth. So right now, the sixth is ruling, and the seventh is yet to come, from John's standpoint.
There are seven kings. Five are fallen. One is, and that would be Nero or Domitian at this time. And the other is yet to come, the seventh one. And when he comes, he must continue a short space. That would be the antichrist, with the old Babylonian system. He will only have a short time. In fact, heaven is going to declare that he only rule for an hour.
Revelation 17:3 - So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
So, he's caught up in the spirit realm and he saw a woman sit upon a scarlet colored beast. This would be the same beast of Revelation Chapter 13, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. Yup, that's him!
Revelation 17:4 - And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
And the woman was clothed in purple and scarlet color, the color of royalty. And she was decked with gold and precious stones and pearls. Boy, she's looking good! Having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
Revelation 17:6 - And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration (THAUMA MEGA) meaning astonished. He was thoroughly taken in by this sight, a beautiful woman riding on the beast. He was astonished, awestruck!
Revelation 17:8 - The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
Again, it's not a matter of switching books. Again, another book in which they are not in.
Revelation 17:1 - And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:
This woman, this prostitute, this whore as she is called, is the religious system who is going to ride the beast, the political system. The religious system riding the political system and the religious system is called the prostitute. In James 4:4, it says that if you are a friend of the world, you will have committed adultery against God. Once you belong to Christ, if you go back into the world and serve others in a worshipful way, it is spiritual adultery against God.
I will show you the judgment of the great whore that sits upon many waters. We'll see soon that the waters represent nations.
Revelation 17:2 - With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.
This is all spiritual. People are to be sober minded. It's not that your mind becomes drunk with alcohol, but your mind becomes drunk with the things of the world. It controls your whole life. You can't sleep at night. You don't get along with people. It's intoxicating!
It's very important to know that Paul especially for those who are God's people, he fought for their minds, so Satan wouldn't occupy the attention of their minds, and they could be able to focus on the word of God and receive from God's Spirit and His word.
Once you're saved, Satan wants the attention of your mind. He can't possess your mind, but he can possess the attention of your mind. That's a teaching in the scripture and there's a Greek word (MERIMNA) which has to do with Satan's only weapon against a believer, the occupation of the attention of the mind.
So, they commit fornication with her, and she makes the inhabitants of the world drunk with the wine of her fornication.
Part two: How will AI be used for the Mark of the Beast
In this posting; I am continuing to say that AI appears to be a tool assisting the Antichrist deception but along with computer chips under the skin; as I stated earlier I believe some genetic transformation will be promised to be able to be immortal like the Antichrist. That will likely come from the concept that the king of the Abyss mentioned earlier will be the one who will perhaps inhabit this Beast; although Satan will be the one empowering him as God allows it at that time.
In terms of imaginary landscapes and fantasy worlds; we are no doubt largely there at this point as far as living in a dream world where we are somehow able to summon gods or genies through the joystick or other means so that we get the dopamine fix as to whatever sick fantasy we desire. Basically that leaves us no better than rats in a lab; or the preverbal "Pavlov's dog" state where we have a reward based on routine and expected behaviors. That is the sad reality of all this.
Nonetheless; Antichrist demands actual worship even if he uses technology somehow with the "Mark" to enforce a death penalty remotely as the verses seem to suggest. No one is going to pretend to get the mark to survive; allegiance has to be given to the Beast through worship first as a prerequisite. This is why we don't need to concern ourselves before the time of being tricked into getting this mark; as it will be very clear that Satan is the one who is receiving the worship at that time. This is why the woman on the Beast ends abruptly (see Revelation 17:16-18). Hence all false and true religion will be terminated with only worship of the Beast allowed.
I would also surmise that the judgments by God will eliminate what is left of the power grid; thus there will be no more time for fantasy games and such. That is again why solar powered technology with the mark makes sense to me.
1 Timothy 6:12 - Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.
The word fight as a command is the word AGONIDZO, agonize, the good agony of faith. It doesn't mean that in your human effort, you're going out to conquer the world or fight for the things of Christ in the world. It's an athletic term. It's what athletes go through in their discipline, their focus, and in their purpose. They agonize through the agony of being an athlete.
1 Timothy 6:16 - Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
In Verses 15 and 16, we have the creed concerning Christ. Verses 12 to 14 was the commands concerning our confession. This is the creed concerning Christ. He says Timothy, here's what you confessed. Hold to it. The first one is: who shall show the blessed and only Potentate. That's Jesus Christ. Potentate means power.
Secondly, the King of kings, and Lord of lords. That's all one phrase for God. It's a phrase for Jesus. Jesus is called King of kings, and Lord of lords in Revelation 17:14 and in Revelation 19:16. He is the only blessed, and the only power. He is the King of kings, and Lord of lords.
Thirdly, the only one that has immortality.
Fourthly, He is dwelling in the light, constantly, this light which no man can approach; and whom no man has seen, nor can see:
His invisibility is the fifth thing. To whom be the honor and the glory, or literally strength, KRATOS. Whenever a writer uses the word KRATOS to describe power, and there's different words for power, DUNAMIS is where we get our word dynamite, and that's the normal word for power. But KRATOS means grip. It shows somebody who's in control. The whole universe is in the grip of Christ. So, to Him be the honor. To Him be the power, the grip, forever!
2 Esdras 15:46-49 and Revelation 17: 5 are identical descriptions of Rome.
Asia in this Context is Asian Minor which at the time of writing was held by Rome and is also identified as Asia in Revelation 1:4
Mystery Babylon is the Roman Empire, 2 Esdras above is speaking about Constantinople which the Ottoman Turks vanquished. The Roman Empire at the time contained the cities of the 7 churches in Revelation 1 and 2. Those 7 churches were cities within the Roman Empire at the time of writing.
Just as the Bride of Christ as a woman is a church, so too is the Whore and the Harlot daughters. The Bride of Christ is the true Church. The Whore and the Harlot daughters are false churches. They take the name of Christ, but they don't follow the Commandments of God. Specifically, they reject the 4th Commandment and in doing so they break all of the others too.
Luke 6:46
"And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"
Matthew 15:9
"But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men."
Mark 7:8
"For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do."
Isaiah 4:1
And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, We will eat our own bread, and wear our own apparel: only let us be called by thy name, to take away our reproach.
These Harlots and the Whore wear polluted Spiritual clothing. They eat Spiritually polluted bread. (They taint and serve polluted teaching as if it were the word of God) They claim to be Christian, but are Christian in name only, because they reject God's Commandments and teach doctrine of men in it's place. Those 7 women are the churches in Revelation 1 and 2. That man is Jesus Christ. The Whore is the Roman Catholic Church and the Harlot daughters are the churches that broke away, IE. Protestant, Baptist, etc... All keep Sunday rather than Saturday as Commanded and practice pagan rites/idolatry.
46 And thou, Asia, that art partaker of the hope of Babylon, and art the glory of her person:
47 Woe be unto thee, thou wretch, because thou hast made thyself like unto her; and hast decked thy daughters in whoredom, that they might please and glory in thy lovers, which have always desired to commit whoredom with thee.
48 Thou hast followed her that is hated in all her works and inventions:
The above happened when the Ottoman Turks overthrew Constantinople. The name of the city was then changed to Istanbul (Modern day Turkey). This was the advent of gunpowder and modern weapons.
Prior to verse 46 above is the conquest of Babylon by Cyrus the Great.
Starting at verse 46, it speaks about the Ottoman conquest of the Roman city of Constantinople.
2 Esdras 16 goes on to talk about the 4th end-time Kingdom, spoken of in Daniel, which is Rome (Holy SEE; see wickepedia.) overseeing the United Nations today and it's spiritual wickedness in doing so. Rome went through 3 initial transitional phases, before coming to what it is today. Starting; First, as a Monarchy, Next, to a Republic, Then to an Empire. Under the third phase, Rome as an Empire, was split into East and West. The Western region was eventually overthrown by conflicts and waring tribes, leaving only the Eastern portion intact. The fall of Constantinople ended the Empire. (Deadly head wound) Which was healed when Papel Rome sprang back up in Italy as it is now today and now uses it's position to exert influence over the entire world via the United Nations Agenda.
Sorry for the delay, I did not reply concerning the two beasts in Revelation 13 my reply was about the last week of Daniel 9:27 being put at the end times, my understanding is different. As far as the sea means waters and could be the Gentile nations you may be correct, we know it won't be Israel.
If we look at Revelation 11:7 and Revelation 17:8 this beast ascendeth out of the bottomless pit, so the word sea in Revelation 13 may mean the abyss, just a thought.
The message below is for your meditation, as a clue, to decipher an enigma / conundrum.
As you know, Revelation 13 describes two terrible different Beasts:
Beast of sea(verse 1),
Beast of the earth(verse 11)
Which of the two Beasts are you referring to?
According to the Revelation, sea means waters, waters mean peoples, and nations, and multitues of all tongues- Revelation 17:15-i.e. Gentile nations, so the Beast of sea is a Gentile Beast.
The Beast of earth has two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a DRAGON (a false lamb), by allegory, earth here is Israel, the clay( Isaiah 64:8) a dry land, like an isle in the sea, a portion of earth surrounded by waters (gentile peoples) on all sides.
According to the Daniel 9:27, he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week. Revelation 13:2 says the DRAGON shall give to the GENTILE Beast of sea his Power, and his Seat(his throne in Jerusalem), and great Authority. And in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations( Daniel 12:11) he shall make it desolate until the consummation.
THREE UNCLEAN SPIRITS LIKE FROGS - Revelation 16:13
I searched deeply an explanation for this biblical mystery, and by the Word of GOD what I found is the follow:
First of all, frogs are amphibians vertebrate animals that live in the aquatic environment and on the terrestrial environment. But is it the same in the spiritual environment? Yes, it is.
1-AQUATIC ENVIRONMENT OF THE EVIL SPIRITS LIKE FROGS
Revelation 17:15-And the angel saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. NOTE: Except the TRUE CHRISTIANS/ ELIEVERS, all the peoples of all the nations are leaded and guided by the THREE UNCLEAN SPIRITS like frogs.TERRIBLE.
The aquatic environment of these three spirits of demons like frogs which guide the peoples or rule nations of all tongues in whole earth, through devilish systems, as religious systems(Catholicism, and Judaism, spiritism, budhism, islamism, among others),and also political systems,and military systems,and social and cultural systems,among others systems. In fact, Satan goes to and fro and from walking up and down among them.
2 - TERRESTRIAL ENVIRONMENT OF THE EVIL SPIRITS LIKE FROGS
FIRST we need to understand that Israel is an island among the waters (Gentile nations)or in the middle of the sea, as is described above in according the Scriptures. Israel is the earth, a dry land, Genesis 1:v.10-3rd Day-or still the clay- Isaiah 64:v.8-a dry land surrounded by water on all sides or by allegory surrounded by the Gentile nations. Isaiah prophesyed saying: Is.41:1-2 -> 1-Keep silence before me,O islands; and let the people renew their strength:let them come near;then let them speak:let us come near together to Judgment.
2 Who raised up the righteous man from the east,called him to his foot,gave the nations before him,and made him rule over kings?he gave them as the dust to his Sword- Revelation 2:v.26 to 28-,and as driven stubble to his bow.(bow- Revelation 6:v.2)
IF it is the case that "his people" mentioned in Daniel 12:1 are the Jews; then it would mean that the CHURCH is the righteous who are resurrected at the time of the Rapture which occurs immediately after. The OLD TESTAMENT saints rise later. I don't want to get into detail on this posting about that event.
We have scripture which specifically discusses Israel and others which describe conditions in the entire world and of course some that seem to indicate both events in the book of Revelation. Whatever happens in the first part of the Tribulation it appears that it primarily is involved with persecution of the false Babylon system against true believers; whereas later on it is the Antichrist and forced worship of himself.
Revelation 17:16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
This "whore" is basically a false religious system which appears to be an amalgamation of all the false religions and an apostate Christianity. There is an ECONOMIC part and a spiritual part to this system. The CITY Babylon and its destruction is listed in detail not only in Revelation 17 and 18 but also in vast numbers of passages in Jeremiah in particular. I see myself strong suspicion that if the Lord comes very soon it ineed IS the USA but if He lingers the planned enormous city in the area of Dubai 30 times the size of New York City with drones and ultramodern technology could also be where this prophetic fulfillment takes place. If it is the former than indeed the whole USA could be burned up with no survivors. Indeed that IS the fate of most of the world as seen in this verse Isaiah 24:15 Wherefore glorify ye the LORD in the fires, even the name of the LORD God of Israel in the isles of the sea. There is hope that some will repent therefore even in the midst of these great judgments.
It will be awesome but there will be horrible times before He returns. If we are still living, we must be strong in our faith to resist the hour of temptation that is coming. When He returns it will not be some silent secret event, Revelation 1:7 and Matthew 23:39. He will return to the same place from where He ascended, Acts 1:10-11. When He touches His feet back on earth on the Mount of Olives the earth will split with the power and glory that has been given Him by God, Zechariah 14:4.
There will be the chosen and faithful, Revelation 17:14 who have been grafted into the vine in the first resurrection, Revelation 20:5-6 that will be a part of this kingdom and reign for one thousand years.
I see that John,the Apostle,as a Jewish citzen,one among the"sand' of the sea-i.e.descendants of Abraham,saw a Beast rise up out of the sea(rose up out of the Gentile peoples/nations- Revelation 17:15),having seven heads and ten horns,and upon his horns ten crowns,and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.What's name? Revelation 13:18 says:Here is wisdom.Let him that has understanding COUNT the number of the Beast:for it is the number of a MAN;and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
/And the Beast which I saw was like unto a LEOPARD,and his feet were as the feet of a BEAR,and his mouth as the mouth of a LION:and the dragon( Revelation 13:11)gave him his Power,and his Seat(in Jerusalem),and great Authority.(In this verse 2 is revealed the ROOTS/THE ORIGIN of the Beast of sea for those who looking back in time,even from when John saw the Apocalypse and we also see from these current days,but Daniel in His vision of the future Beast of sea he wrote that he saw 4 great Beasts that came up from the SEA(from Gentile nations),diverse one from another,as follow:
The 1st was like a LION,
and the 2nd Beast like to a BEAR,
after this I beheld the 3rd like a LEOPARD;(John and we,looking back,we see 1st leopard,2nd bear, and 3rd lion-Rev.13:2)
and behold a 4th Beast,dreadful and terrible,and strong exceedingly;and it had great IRON teeth:it devoured and brake in pieces,and stamped the residue with the feet of it:and it was DIVERSE from all the(3)Beasts that were before it;and it had 10 horns(that is the Beast of sea- Revelation 13:1-whose embryo was formed in the Roman Empire-in the 4th Beast)
I considered the(10)horns(linked to the Beast of sea)and behold,there came up among them(among 10 horns-10 tribes)another little horn(the illeventh horn will rise up from the earth-from the little Israel-a Beast like a lamb,a false lamb- Revelation 13:11 combined with John 5:43-47)
Revelation is very symbolic, but it is also the GOSPEL, the revealing of Jesus Christ.
Until the spirit causes you to SEE and UNDERSTAND that the Word of God is talking to the person reading it, and that person reading those words Is the most likely the SYMBOL your reading about, you will stay in darkness.
Revelation is addressing the church, but that church is not the RCC or the Baptist, of any other denomination church.
Your the CHURCH, and WE are riding the beast with the name WHORE written in our head.
We blaspheme HIS NAME every day by not believing what he SAYS.
You were BAPTISED by his resurrection INTO HIS NAME.
Revelation 21:22 And I saw no TEMPLE (church) therein, because the Lord God Almighty and the LAMB are the TEMPLE (CHURCH) thereof.
2 Corinthians 6:16 .....for ye are TEMPLE of the LIVING GOD ....
You and Christ BECAME ONE: BY HIS RESURRECTION.
A beast has NO KNOWLEDGE of God; we ride the beast, until: We are BORN AGAIN by the words (truth and knowledge) of God.
Revelation 17:16 And the ten horns (the power of God, given to you by the truth and knowledge of God)) that thou sawest on the beast, THESE (the NEW CREATION) shall HATE the WHORE, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall ear her flesh, and burn her with fire.
Hebrews 12:29 Our God is a consuming fire ..... you WERE made ONE with Christ .... you are in, and have become the lake of fire.
Hebrews 1:7 ...and maketh his ministers A FLAME of FIRE .....
Isaiah 9:20 .... and shall EVERY MAN eat the FLESH of his own right arm ....
The Papacy and the RCC-which rides upon the MAN Beast of sea- Revelation 13:1-,the Pope,a Gentile Beast,actually a religious and satanic MONSTER having 7 heads and 10 horns,and upon his horns 10 crowns,and upon his heads a NAME of blasphemy,this religious MONSTER will do a partnership with the MAN Beast of the earth- Revelation 13:11-,who has two horns like a lamb(a false lamb,a false messiah- John 5:43-47-AN IMPOSTOR),who will manifest in days to come,probably in this year or in the next,and shall speak as a dragon- Revelation 13:11
How will be this partnership between the MAN Beast of the sea(sea are peoples,and nations,and multitudes of all tongues- Revelation 17:15),and the MAN Beast of the earth that is like a lamb,a false lamb,a false messiah,AN IMPOSTOR- John 5:43-,yeah, how will be this partnership?
Revelation 13:2 gives us the answer for this question, that is:
To the MAN Beast of sea which is like unto a leopard,and his feet as the feet of a bear,and his mouth as the mouth of a lion(actually it refers the roots of this satanic Gentile Beast- Daniel 7:4-6, yeah, to him the false messiah-the dragon-Rev.13:11-,will give his Power, and his Seat(in Jerusalem, where is the Throne of Satan),and great Authority-Rev.13:2,and Power will be given unto the MAN Beast of sea-to the last of the Popes or Papacy,for forty and two months- Revelation 13:5.By the way,this period of 42 months ruled by the last Pope sat in the Throne of the false messiah in Jerusalem is the FIRST HALF of the last week-week 70th, Daniel 9:27,so Catholicism(iron)and the esoteric and kabbalistic Judaism(the clay)both will be together to establish an Universal and satanic religious kingdom,and then will LITERALLY be fulfilled what my Lord JESUS prophesied: "...and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles(with the Pope enthroned in Jerusalem by the false messiah),until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled-that is the fullness of the Gentiles"- Luke 21:24 combined with Revelation 11:2
We are in the "Church Age" at this point; and heading toward the final version of the "Revived Roman Empire" as seen in Daniel 2:42-44. The final composite kingdom of the Antichrist is like a lion (Babylonian symbol but modern day Great Britain); a bear (Media Persian symbol also Russia) a leopard (fitting into the Greek or Mediterranean Kingdom); and the final composite Beast of the last days which encompasses the entire earth ( Daniel 7:2-8). This will come eventually with the Antichrist for "one hour" (probably the 7 Year Tribulation) taking over a kingdom of 10 Kings who are yet to have a kingdom ( Revelation 17:12).
Since nations are still mentioned in verses about the Millennium ( Psalm 86:9 as one example) coming to the Lord it is clear they are in God's design to be restored. For now; territorial integrity is important; although God will have to settle many disputes when He comes ( Isaiah 2:4).
God has established through the Abrahamic covenant and other promises to Joshua and Caleb that He would give the 12 Tribes inheritance of all the territory described from the "Great Sea" to the Euphrates ( Joshua 1:4). God does honor covenants though; so agreements made with those in other nations or even Israel itself say with settlements should be honored.
We also need to keep in mind Joshua 5:14 where the Angel of the Lord states He is for the Lord's army not necessarily siding with anyone. This is why God allowed Israel's enemies to prosper at times for chastisement; as was made clear in God's prophecies about Babylon and even the pagan invaders stated this (although I can't find the verse at present). It is humbling to think about this at present; we in our proud nation think the worst thing to happen would be invasion from another nation and submission but are we better than Israel and the Babylonians? This may happen before the Tribulation if He tarries (our borders are already breached BTW). Food for thought.
There are two women in Revelation, one is a harlot with a name.. Mystery, Babylon the great, the mother of harlots and abominations of the earth. Revelation 17:5. The other is God's true church, the bride of Christ.
James 1:15 illustrates the process of sin leading eventually to death. Thus; Adam began to die in all ways once he sinned; spiritually immediately as Ezekiel 18:20 indicates it affects the soul and the death in the body continues until eventually we return back to the dust we came from. Hence; there was immediate estrangement from God when Adam and Eve hid; and God pronounced the resulting curse in childbirth; tilling the earth is sweat with thistles and thorns; etc.
We must also understand that there are those predestined to be in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world ( Ephesians 1:3-6). The opposite is true for the unregenerate as seen in Revelation 17:8. Christ's death was therefore part of a plan from before Creation where all those would hear His voice who were His sheep ( John 10:27). We must remember that His death was effective from what happened in time and space 2000 years ago. It also is retroactive; as it were in order to allow those who were of old to eventually in time and space have access to heaven (see Romans 6:9). Therefore; at the Rapture ( 1 Thess. 4:15) shall involve the Resurrection of all souls of deceased saints; followed by bodily ascension of those alive and remaining. There are some verses which seem to indicate O.T. saints may arise later on in say the Midpoint of the Tribulation or near the end; there is some debate on that question. Some already apparently were resurrected ( Matt. 27:52-56). This would have been a gleaning of the firstfruits; so to speak.
My point here is predestination and the fact that God initiates repentance ( Acts 11:18); etc. There is such a thing as godly repentance and worldly ( 2 Cor. 7:10); illustrated by that of Peter and Judas Iscariot. Genuine repentance brings life and brings sorrow at offending a Holy God; worldly sorrow only is interested in consequences of our actions; and in Judas' case he only recognized Christ as having "innocent blood"; not as God's Son to be worshipped.
Starting from the Destruction of Jerusalem in 70 c.e.
until he comes. Then there's God's Wrath coming against Satan the Devil (the Dragon, Serpent REV. chapter 12), Wild beast (Authorities, Kings, HORNS chapter 17,18), and False Religion (Babylon the Great, Prostitute Revelation 17:1-6; Revelation 20:1,10)
Revelation 17 spoken in illustration then the angel explains
Revelation 18 spoken in illustration how powerful Babylon the great is (False Religion:The Great City)
Revelation 22 spoken partly in illustration and then true talk at the end
Rather it's believed or not, the scriptures (The law passed from Heaven Psalm 83:18) has spoken. 2 Peter 1:20,21
I agree, when Jesus returns, it will not be a secret, as all the Scriptures proclaim, it will be with the sound of the trumpet, the last trumpet, 1 Corinthians 15:52, 1 Thessalonians 4:16, Revelation 11:15. As you said, every eye shall see Him coming in the clouds, Revelation 1:7, Revelation 19:11-16.
The resurrection of the righteous, which is the first resurrection, will happen at Christ's return, Revelation 19:11-16, Revelation 20:4-6. Scripture does not say Jesus goes back to heaven. 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 Paul is comforting them that those who are asleep/dead in Christ would not be left out of the return of Christ and the resurrection. Nowhere in these verses does it say we are taken to heaven.
If we read and study Scriptures with preconceived assumptions, it fogs the truth. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8 is about the return of Jesus and our gathering together unto Him on earth, at His coming. It says do not let man deceive you because Jesus will not return until two things happen. The falling away/apostasy, and the man of sin is revealed.
Revelation 19:20 is where the beast and the false prophet are cast into the lake of fire. In Revelation 17:14, they are the ones in the first resurrection who are in the battle of Armageddon with Jesus, and in Revelation 20:4 are the ones in the first resurrection who are being judged at the judgment seat of Christ, here on earth.
God bless,
RLW
Thank you, this is my understanding.
I understand many believe in the rapture, some say pre, mid, or post. In all three views, we are taken to heaven. I have not found any Scripture that explicitly states we are taken to heaven; it is an assumption, and it must be read where it is not written. I don't see the bride mentioned in the rapture doctrine; that's another discussion.
I see the coming of Jesus not as a secret event, but as one the world will witness. This is supported by Scripture: Matthew 24:29-31, 1 Corinthians 15:51-54, 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, and Revelation 19:11-16. This event occurs after the seventh angel sounds the last trumpet, Revelation 11:15. Then, we see the angel summoning the birds for the battle of Armageddon.
The ones in the first resurrection, Revelation 20:4-6, will be with Jesus during the battle, Revelation 17:12-14. Afterward, we observe the judgment of those in the first resurrection, Revelation 20:4.
A thought, over the past nearly 2000 years, believers in Christ, the body of Christ, the Church have faced beheading, burning at the stake, being placed on poles soaked in oil, lit as lamps along roads, among other horrible deaths. Why would the last of the Church be spared? We have been told we will face much tribulation, and if we endure, Matthew 24:9-13. The Great Tribulation and the wrath of God are not the same.
God bless,
RLW
Daniel 7:7-8, 23-24
The Fourth Beast (Rome) has 10 horns = 10 kings.
Then a Little Horn (Antichrist) arises, uprooting 3 of the 10.
That leaves 7 remaining horns, now under the Little Horn's dominance.
So:
Start with 10.
3 fall.
7 remain, all ruled by the Antichrist.
2. Revelation's Horns
Revelation 17:12
The 10 horns are 10 kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but will receive power for "one hour" with the Beast.
They hand over authority to the Beast.
So again, 10 leaders/nations fully aligned under the Beast.
3. Merging the Two (10 + 7 + 3 = 20)
If we treat Daniel's 10 horns (with 3 uprooted + 7 left) and Revelation's 10 horns as complementary visions of the final configuration, then:
10 (Dan) + 10 (Rev) = 20 rulers/kingdoms.
But Daniel shows 3 fall, and the rest (7 + 10) become subject to the Beast.
That makes 20 powers reduced to full submission under 1 ruler (the Beast).
4. G20 as a Modern Echo
The G20 = the 20 leading economies of the world.
Includes: USA, UK, EU (Germany, France, Italy), Russia, China, Japan, plus emerging powers (India, Brazil, South Africa, etc.).
Collectively, they control 80-85% of global GDP.
They already act as a supra-national council of rulers.
So prophetically:
G20 looks like a modern prefiguration of the horns.
A coalition of 20 powers, out of which:
Some will be subdued (3 uprooted).
Others (7 + remaining) align with the Beast.
Fits perfectly with Daniel + Revelation pattern.
5. Timeline with the Harlot + Beast
Great Harlot dominates global finance, but is destroyed ( Rev 17:16).
Seventh Head (G7/USA-led system) holds sway, but weakens.
Ten Horns (plus total 20 powers = G20) rise in final alignment.
Beast emerges as supreme, absorbing them all the Eighth Kingdom.
Resolution is G20 could be the prophetic prototype of the 20 horns/powers John and Daniel saw.
It's not just random: the number and the role fit strikingly.
Phoenicians (Tyre, Sidon, Carthage) = first great maritime trading empire, controlling colonies across the Mediterranean.
Rome absorbed that legacy after Carthage fell.
Later, Venice, Genoa carried it for a while.
Thus Harlot = the modern Tyre + Rome's imperial heir.
Revelation 17:18: "The woman is that great city which reigns over the kings of the
The Seventh Kingdom (USA)
Revelation 17:10: "Five are fallen, one is, the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space."
Five fallen = Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece.
One is = Rome (St John's time).
Seventh = USA-led order (short-lived compared to Rome's centuries).
Why USA?
Global dominance after WWII (military, economy, culture).
Short space compared to ancient empires (Rome = 500+ years, USA hegemony =
Based on my last post; many seem to think that Satan gets great glee in deceiving souls and sending them to hell. Considering that he is going there himself he may be mad enough to somehow think he can avoid his fate but anyone else being there with him I doubt gives him any consolation. We are to him most likely a means to an end to achieve a dream that is destined to fail; that is worldwide worship as the Godhead has only reserved for itself and of course the only Creator to be praised. Unlike our Lord who chastises everyone He loves; and in fact allows those angels who haven't left their first estate to observe and learn from us; nothing more constructive is or can be gained by Satan or his minions in their fallen state. Not being able to control his own fate has no doubt contributed to maniacal schemes to seize control once 2 Thessalonians 2:10 states For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
What we see from Revelation 17:16 is men (10 kings of the earth) destroying the woman on the Beast which is the false world religious system the first half of the Tribulation. This is no doubt to allow their beloved Antichrist to fulfill Satan's desire that he alone is worshipped and this facilitates their ability to have worldwide rulership for that short 3 and a half year time frame. There is much detail as to how the false religious system is a smokescreen; or a means to an end along with the parallel influence of a false prosperity for some in the worldwide economic boom as it were; which apparently extends even further the already bloated super rich class from others who are dying like flies from the plagues and poverty on the earth from the earlier seal and ensuing beginning of the Trumpet judgments. More study on this timing can be pursued later.
All who worship the Beast are NOT in the Lamb's book of life; the mark seals the deal
Revelation is difficult to discuss briefly, and I may have stumbled.
I tried to explain that Revelation isn't arranged in order like other books in the Bible, and I didn't do a good job. Jesus doesn't return until the seventh trumpet, the last trump, 1 Corinthians 15:52, Revelation 10:7.
I'm sorry, but I don't know much about Premillennialism, Amillennialism, or Postmillennialism. I haven't studied them, and I don't care for titles.
My understanding is that Jesus returns in Revelation 19:11-16, and the saints are resurrected, Matthew 24:29-31, Revelation 20:4-6.
This is when the great tribulation ends, and God's wrath is poured out, Revelation 15:7, Revelation 16:1-17.
Next comes the battle of Armageddon, Revelation 19:17-21 which those in the first resurrection will participate, Revelation 17:14. Their Judgement is shown in Revelation 20:4. The beast and the false prophet are cast into the lake of fire, and those who worshiped the beast and had the mark are either cast in then or during the white throne judgment, but their verdict was already given, Revelation 14:9-10.
Then the kingdom will be established, and there will be people left in the nations whom Satan, after he is released, will deceive.
The land of Israel will be restored, Ezekiel 11:17, Jeremiah 23:5-6, and members of the tribes of Israel that will be gathered from all the nations will inhabit that land during the 1000 years, Jeremiah 29:14. Other nations will, as seen in Zechariah 14:16-20, witness Jesus ruling with a rod of iron; there are other Scriptures about this time.
I hope this makes things clearer.
God bless,
RLW
My understanding of the coming of Jesus, the first resurrection, and the gathering of saints to Him, which I see as a one-time event. I understand many may disagree, but I feel in my heart that the teaching of the rapture as a separate event may be incorrect. We must understand that in Revelation, the events recorded in the book are not a linear timeline.
Jesus returns only once, which is what Paul warns about. In 2 Timothy 2:16-18, I believe Paul is addressing the same issue he talks about in 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8. Paul says, Let no man deceive you by any means, and he is speaking about the coming of the Lord. He states that that day will not come unless there is a falling away first, meaning apostasy or a turning away from faith, and the revealing of the man of sin, the son of perdition, which signifies destruction.
Both of these events must happen before Jesus returns. Just as back then, false teachings about the timing and details of Jesus' return, as I feel the idea of a separate rapture, many are expecting something that is not going to happen, and when it becomes evident to those still here, that moment will lead to the falling away. I feel great tribulation and the wrath of God are not the same.
When Jesus returns, we observe the first resurrection, the battle of Armageddon, and the judgment of those in the first resurrection in Revelation 19:11 through Revelation 20:4-6. This judgment includes those who did not worship the beast or take his mark. This proves it is after the great tribulation. Those who fought with Jesus in this battle are the chosen and faithful, Revelation 17:14. These are the ones in the first resurrection; they will reign with Jesus on earth, not in heaven.
Thank you, brother, for this discussion that I feel is very important and will continue to study. It is up to each of us to pray in search of the truth.
God bless,
RLW
I am doing my best to follow and study what you are posting, just one or two questions. I agree if you say the first resurrection is when Jesus returns to earth, in Revelation 19, is the rapture. We see in Revelation 17:14 when the Lamb overcomes the beast and the 10 kings/battle of Armageddon, the ones with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.
You say, "After the thousand years, we leave with Christ. And the people on the earth who are left over from the tribulation, who still are not saved, but they've been given this one-thousand-year opportunity to live under the rule of Christ with Satan bound, when Satan is let loose, we will see that they will go back to serving Satan again."
After 1000 years, where do we go if we leave with Jesus? It seems you are saying those who go through the tribulation are given 1000 years to repent, so do people not die during the 1000 years? Are there no saved during the 1000 years? Forgive me if I am misunderstanding this.
Thanks, brother
God bless,
RLW
Revelation 17:12 - And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
And that's the 10-nation confederacy that is already formed. But three will be absorbed into the seven.
Revelation 17:16 - And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
Now what in the world is going on here?
The beast is only going to allow the religious system, the prophet, to ride this beast for so long. And the ten nations are going to give their allegiance to this woman. But when the antichrist is through with her, then he's going to turn against her, as well as the kings because they're going to be on his side, and she's going to be destroyed, this religious system.
Revelation 17:17 - For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.
God says this is my will. Give all of your allegiance to this woman. But God says that once my plan is fulfilled, then I'm going to turn them against her. And they will destroy her.
Revelation 17:18 - And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.
And the woman which you saw is the great city, which reigns over the kings of the earth. That's Rome, cryptic Babylon.
Revelation 18:3 - For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
Everybody's mind was intoxicated with the economic, political, and religious system of the world.
Revelation 17:9 - And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.
And here is the mind which has wisdom. The seven heads are seven hills, on which the woman sits. It's the city on seven hills. Does anybody know what it is? It is Rome. It is cryptically known as Babylon in the book of Revelation. There are other theories out there but with every other description we are given in Revelation Chapter 17, Rome fits every category.
Revelation 17:10 - And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he comes, he must continue a short time.
Now what all this means is that there are five kings that have ruled. At the time of John is the sixth. So far, Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, the Medo-Persians, and Greece have ruled. The sixth is Rome that's under the rule at the time that John was writing.
He's going to tell us in Verse 11, just to throw more confusion at us, he says that one is going to rise up, who is the seventh, and will become the eighth. So right now, the sixth is ruling, and the seventh is yet to come, from John's standpoint.
There are seven kings. Five are fallen. One is, and that would be Nero or Domitian at this time. And the other is yet to come, the seventh one. And when he comes, he must continue a short space. That would be the antichrist, with the old Babylonian system. He will only have a short time. In fact, heaven is going to declare that he only rule for an hour.
Revelation 17:3 - So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
So, he's caught up in the spirit realm and he saw a woman sit upon a scarlet colored beast. This would be the same beast of Revelation Chapter 13, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. Yup, that's him!
Revelation 17:4 - And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
And the woman was clothed in purple and scarlet color, the color of royalty. And she was decked with gold and precious stones and pearls. Boy, she's looking good! Having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
Revelation 17:6 - And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration (THAUMA MEGA) meaning astonished. He was thoroughly taken in by this sight, a beautiful woman riding on the beast. He was astonished, awestruck!
Revelation 17:8 - The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
Again, it's not a matter of switching books. Again, another book in which they are not in.
Revelation 17:1 - And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:
This woman, this prostitute, this whore as she is called, is the religious system who is going to ride the beast, the political system. The religious system riding the political system and the religious system is called the prostitute. In James 4:4, it says that if you are a friend of the world, you will have committed adultery against God. Once you belong to Christ, if you go back into the world and serve others in a worshipful way, it is spiritual adultery against God.
I will show you the judgment of the great whore that sits upon many waters. We'll see soon that the waters represent nations.
Revelation 17:2 - With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.
This is all spiritual. People are to be sober minded. It's not that your mind becomes drunk with alcohol, but your mind becomes drunk with the things of the world. It controls your whole life. You can't sleep at night. You don't get along with people. It's intoxicating!
It's very important to know that Paul especially for those who are God's people, he fought for their minds, so Satan wouldn't occupy the attention of their minds, and they could be able to focus on the word of God and receive from God's Spirit and His word.
Once you're saved, Satan wants the attention of your mind. He can't possess your mind, but he can possess the attention of your mind. That's a teaching in the scripture and there's a Greek word (MERIMNA) which has to do with Satan's only weapon against a believer, the occupation of the attention of the mind.
So, they commit fornication with her, and she makes the inhabitants of the world drunk with the wine of her fornication.
In this posting; I am continuing to say that AI appears to be a tool assisting the Antichrist deception but along with computer chips under the skin; as I stated earlier I believe some genetic transformation will be promised to be able to be immortal like the Antichrist. That will likely come from the concept that the king of the Abyss mentioned earlier will be the one who will perhaps inhabit this Beast; although Satan will be the one empowering him as God allows it at that time.
In terms of imaginary landscapes and fantasy worlds; we are no doubt largely there at this point as far as living in a dream world where we are somehow able to summon gods or genies through the joystick or other means so that we get the dopamine fix as to whatever sick fantasy we desire. Basically that leaves us no better than rats in a lab; or the preverbal "Pavlov's dog" state where we have a reward based on routine and expected behaviors. That is the sad reality of all this.
Nonetheless; Antichrist demands actual worship even if he uses technology somehow with the "Mark" to enforce a death penalty remotely as the verses seem to suggest. No one is going to pretend to get the mark to survive; allegiance has to be given to the Beast through worship first as a prerequisite. This is why we don't need to concern ourselves before the time of being tricked into getting this mark; as it will be very clear that Satan is the one who is receiving the worship at that time. This is why the woman on the Beast ends abruptly (see Revelation 17:16-18). Hence all false and true religion will be terminated with only worship of the Beast allowed.
I would also surmise that the judgments by God will eliminate what is left of the power grid; thus there will be no more time for fantasy games and such. That is again why solar powered technology with the mark makes sense to me.
I welcome any comments on the subject.
Agape. RP
1 Timothy 6:12 - Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.
The word fight as a command is the word AGONIDZO, agonize, the good agony of faith. It doesn't mean that in your human effort, you're going out to conquer the world or fight for the things of Christ in the world. It's an athletic term. It's what athletes go through in their discipline, their focus, and in their purpose. They agonize through the agony of being an athlete.
1 Timothy 6:16 - Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
In Verses 15 and 16, we have the creed concerning Christ. Verses 12 to 14 was the commands concerning our confession. This is the creed concerning Christ. He says Timothy, here's what you confessed. Hold to it. The first one is: who shall show the blessed and only Potentate. That's Jesus Christ. Potentate means power.
Secondly, the King of kings, and Lord of lords. That's all one phrase for God. It's a phrase for Jesus. Jesus is called King of kings, and Lord of lords in Revelation 17:14 and in Revelation 19:16. He is the only blessed, and the only power. He is the King of kings, and Lord of lords.
Thirdly, the only one that has immortality.
Fourthly, He is dwelling in the light, constantly, this light which no man can approach; and whom no man has seen, nor can see:
His invisibility is the fifth thing. To whom be the honor and the glory, or literally strength, KRATOS. Whenever a writer uses the word KRATOS to describe power, and there's different words for power, DUNAMIS is where we get our word dynamite, and that's the normal word for power. But KRATOS means grip. It shows somebody who's in control. The whole universe is in the grip of Christ. So, to Him be the honor. To Him be the power, the grip, forever!
Asia in this Context is Asian Minor which at the time of writing was held by Rome and is also identified as Asia in Revelation 1:4
Mystery Babylon is the Roman Empire, 2 Esdras above is speaking about Constantinople which the Ottoman Turks vanquished. The Roman Empire at the time contained the cities of the 7 churches in Revelation 1 and 2. Those 7 churches were cities within the Roman Empire at the time of writing.
Just as the Bride of Christ as a woman is a church, so too is the Whore and the Harlot daughters. The Bride of Christ is the true Church. The Whore and the Harlot daughters are false churches. They take the name of Christ, but they don't follow the Commandments of God. Specifically, they reject the 4th Commandment and in doing so they break all of the others too.
Luke 6:46
"And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"
Matthew 15:9
"But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men."
Mark 7:8
"For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do."
Isaiah 4:1
And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, We will eat our own bread, and wear our own apparel: only let us be called by thy name, to take away our reproach.
These Harlots and the Whore wear polluted Spiritual clothing. They eat Spiritually polluted bread. (They taint and serve polluted teaching as if it were the word of God) They claim to be Christian, but are Christian in name only, because they reject God's Commandments and teach doctrine of men in it's place. Those 7 women are the churches in Revelation 1 and 2. That man is Jesus Christ. The Whore is the Roman Catholic Church and the Harlot daughters are the churches that broke away, IE. Protestant, Baptist, etc... All keep Sunday rather than Saturday as Commanded and practice pagan rites/idolatry.
Just as Babel was confounded, Babylon was conquered by Cyrus the great, but the roots of Babylon and what it stood for and represented, persisted.
Then came Mystery Babylon after the same spirit of wickedness as (Babel and Ancient Babylon).
This was the founding of the Roman City of Constantinople.
2 Esdras 15 (Which corresponds to; Revelation 17:5)
46 And thou, Asia, that art partaker of the hope of Babylon, and art the glory of her person:
47 Woe be unto thee, thou wretch, because thou hast made thyself like unto her; and hast decked thy daughters in whoredom, that they might please and glory in thy lovers, which have always desired to commit whoredom with thee.
48 Thou hast followed her that is hated in all her works and inventions:
The above happened when the Ottoman Turks overthrew Constantinople. The name of the city was then changed to Istanbul (Modern day Turkey). This was the advent of gunpowder and modern weapons.
Prior to verse 46 above is the conquest of Babylon by Cyrus the Great.
Starting at verse 46, it speaks about the Ottoman conquest of the Roman city of Constantinople.
2 Esdras 16 goes on to talk about the 4th end-time Kingdom, spoken of in Daniel, which is Rome (Holy SEE; see wickepedia.) overseeing the United Nations today and it's spiritual wickedness in doing so. Rome went through 3 initial transitional phases, before coming to what it is today. Starting; First, as a Monarchy, Next, to a Republic, Then to an Empire. Under the third phase, Rome as an Empire, was split into East and West. The Western region was eventually overthrown by conflicts and waring tribes, leaving only the Eastern portion intact. The fall of Constantinople ended the Empire. (Deadly head wound) Which was healed when Papel Rome sprang back up in Italy as it is now today and now uses it's position to exert influence over the entire world via the United Nations Agenda.
Sorry for the delay, I did not reply concerning the two beasts in Revelation 13 my reply was about the last week of Daniel 9:27 being put at the end times, my understanding is different. As far as the sea means waters and could be the Gentile nations you may be correct, we know it won't be Israel.
If we look at Revelation 11:7 and Revelation 17:8 this beast ascendeth out of the bottomless pit, so the word sea in Revelation 13 may mean the abyss, just a thought.
Thanks, and God bless,
RLW
The message below is for your meditation, as a clue, to decipher an enigma / conundrum.
As you know, Revelation 13 describes two terrible different Beasts:
Beast of sea(verse 1),
Beast of the earth(verse 11)
Which of the two Beasts are you referring to?
According to the Revelation, sea means waters, waters mean peoples, and nations, and multitues of all tongues- Revelation 17:15-i.e. Gentile nations, so the Beast of sea is a Gentile Beast.
The Beast of earth has two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a DRAGON (a false lamb), by allegory, earth here is Israel, the clay( Isaiah 64:8) a dry land, like an isle in the sea, a portion of earth surrounded by waters (gentile peoples) on all sides.
According to the Daniel 9:27, he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week. Revelation 13:2 says the DRAGON shall give to the GENTILE Beast of sea his Power, and his Seat(his throne in Jerusalem), and great Authority. And in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations( Daniel 12:11) he shall make it desolate until the consummation.
GOD BLESS
I searched deeply an explanation for this biblical mystery, and by the Word of GOD what I found is the follow:
First of all, frogs are amphibians vertebrate animals that live in the aquatic environment and on the terrestrial environment. But is it the same in the spiritual environment? Yes, it is.
1-AQUATIC ENVIRONMENT OF THE EVIL SPIRITS LIKE FROGS
Revelation 17:15-And the angel saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. NOTE: Except the TRUE CHRISTIANS/ ELIEVERS, all the peoples of all the nations are leaded and guided by the THREE UNCLEAN SPIRITS like frogs.TERRIBLE.
The aquatic environment of these three spirits of demons like frogs which guide the peoples or rule nations of all tongues in whole earth, through devilish systems, as religious systems(Catholicism, and Judaism, spiritism, budhism, islamism, among others),and also political systems,and military systems,and social and cultural systems,among others systems. In fact, Satan goes to and fro and from walking up and down among them.
2 - TERRESTRIAL ENVIRONMENT OF THE EVIL SPIRITS LIKE FROGS
FIRST we need to understand that Israel is an island among the waters (Gentile nations)or in the middle of the sea, as is described above in according the Scriptures. Israel is the earth, a dry land, Genesis 1:v.10-3rd Day-or still the clay- Isaiah 64:v.8-a dry land surrounded by water on all sides or by allegory surrounded by the Gentile nations. Isaiah prophesyed saying: Is.41:1-2 -> 1-Keep silence before me,O islands; and let the people renew their strength:let them come near;then let them speak:let us come near together to Judgment.
2 Who raised up the righteous man from the east,called him to his foot,gave the nations before him,and made him rule over kings?he gave them as the dust to his Sword- Revelation 2:v.26 to 28-,and as driven stubble to his bow.(bow- Revelation 6:v.2)
IF it is the case that "his people" mentioned in Daniel 12:1 are the Jews; then it would mean that the CHURCH is the righteous who are resurrected at the time of the Rapture which occurs immediately after. The OLD TESTAMENT saints rise later. I don't want to get into detail on this posting about that event.
We have scripture which specifically discusses Israel and others which describe conditions in the entire world and of course some that seem to indicate both events in the book of Revelation. Whatever happens in the first part of the Tribulation it appears that it primarily is involved with persecution of the false Babylon system against true believers; whereas later on it is the Antichrist and forced worship of himself.
Revelation 17:16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
This "whore" is basically a false religious system which appears to be an amalgamation of all the false religions and an apostate Christianity. There is an ECONOMIC part and a spiritual part to this system. The CITY Babylon and its destruction is listed in detail not only in Revelation 17 and 18 but also in vast numbers of passages in Jeremiah in particular. I see myself strong suspicion that if the Lord comes very soon it ineed IS the USA but if He lingers the planned enormous city in the area of Dubai 30 times the size of New York City with drones and ultramodern technology could also be where this prophetic fulfillment takes place. If it is the former than indeed the whole USA could be burned up with no survivors. Indeed that IS the fate of most of the world as seen in this verse Isaiah 24:15 Wherefore glorify ye the LORD in the fires, even the name of the LORD God of Israel in the isles of the sea. There is hope that some will repent therefore even in the midst of these great judgments.
It will be awesome but there will be horrible times before He returns. If we are still living, we must be strong in our faith to resist the hour of temptation that is coming. When He returns it will not be some silent secret event, Revelation 1:7 and Matthew 23:39. He will return to the same place from where He ascended, Acts 1:10-11. When He touches His feet back on earth on the Mount of Olives the earth will split with the power and glory that has been given Him by God, Zechariah 14:4.
There will be the chosen and faithful, Revelation 17:14 who have been grafted into the vine in the first resurrection, Revelation 20:5-6 that will be a part of this kingdom and reign for one thousand years.
God bless,
RLW
What is adultery in God's eyes?
Is it adultery in the FLESH, or adultery against God in our BELIEFS?
Psalms 103:12 As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.
Revelation 17:5 And upon HER head was a name written: MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS (adulteresses) AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
Which is more important to God, removing ministers that commit adultery in the flesh, or sin against God in their beliefs and teachings.
If the are corrected in their BELIEFS, they want sin in the flesh.
God Bless YOU!
You quoted Rev.13:1-2:
I see that John,the Apostle,as a Jewish citzen,one among the"sand' of the sea-i.e.descendants of Abraham,saw a Beast rise up out of the sea(rose up out of the Gentile peoples/nations- Revelation 17:15),having seven heads and ten horns,and upon his horns ten crowns,and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.What's name? Revelation 13:18 says:Here is wisdom.Let him that has understanding COUNT the number of the Beast:for it is the number of a MAN;and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
/And the Beast which I saw was like unto a LEOPARD,and his feet were as the feet of a BEAR,and his mouth as the mouth of a LION:and the dragon( Revelation 13:11)gave him his Power,and his Seat(in Jerusalem),and great Authority.(In this verse 2 is revealed the ROOTS/THE ORIGIN of the Beast of sea for those who looking back in time,even from when John saw the Apocalypse and we also see from these current days,but Daniel in His vision of the future Beast of sea he wrote that he saw 4 great Beasts that came up from the SEA(from Gentile nations),diverse one from another,as follow:
The 1st was like a LION,
and the 2nd Beast like to a BEAR,
after this I beheld the 3rd like a LEOPARD;(John and we,looking back,we see 1st leopard,2nd bear, and 3rd lion-Rev.13:2)
and behold a 4th Beast,dreadful and terrible,and strong exceedingly;and it had great IRON teeth:it devoured and brake in pieces,and stamped the residue with the feet of it:and it was DIVERSE from all the(3)Beasts that were before it;and it had 10 horns(that is the Beast of sea- Revelation 13:1-whose embryo was formed in the Roman Empire-in the 4th Beast)
I considered the(10)horns(linked to the Beast of sea)and behold,there came up among them(among 10 horns-10 tribes)another little horn(the illeventh horn will rise up from the earth-from the little Israel-a Beast like a lamb,a false lamb- Revelation 13:11 combined with John 5:43-47)
The vision of Daniel fulfilled LITERALLY
Revelation is very symbolic, but it is also the GOSPEL, the revealing of Jesus Christ.
Until the spirit causes you to SEE and UNDERSTAND that the Word of God is talking to the person reading it, and that person reading those words Is the most likely the SYMBOL your reading about, you will stay in darkness.
Revelation is addressing the church, but that church is not the RCC or the Baptist, of any other denomination church.
Your the CHURCH, and WE are riding the beast with the name WHORE written in our head.
We blaspheme HIS NAME every day by not believing what he SAYS.
You were BAPTISED by his resurrection INTO HIS NAME.
Revelation 21:22 And I saw no TEMPLE (church) therein, because the Lord God Almighty and the LAMB are the TEMPLE (CHURCH) thereof.
2 Corinthians 6:16 .....for ye are TEMPLE of the LIVING GOD ....
You and Christ BECAME ONE: BY HIS RESURRECTION.
A beast has NO KNOWLEDGE of God; we ride the beast, until: We are BORN AGAIN by the words (truth and knowledge) of God.
Revelation 17:16 And the ten horns (the power of God, given to you by the truth and knowledge of God)) that thou sawest on the beast, THESE (the NEW CREATION) shall HATE the WHORE, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall ear her flesh, and burn her with fire.
Hebrews 12:29 Our God is a consuming fire ..... you WERE made ONE with Christ .... you are in, and have become the lake of fire.
Hebrews 1:7 ...and maketh his ministers A FLAME of FIRE .....
Isaiah 9:20 .... and shall EVERY MAN eat the FLESH of his own right arm ....
God BLESS YOU!
.
How will be this partnership between the MAN Beast of the sea(sea are peoples,and nations,and multitudes of all tongues- Revelation 17:15),and the MAN Beast of the earth that is like a lamb,a false lamb,a false messiah,AN IMPOSTOR- John 5:43-,yeah, how will be this partnership?
Revelation 13:2 gives us the answer for this question, that is:
To the MAN Beast of sea which is like unto a leopard,and his feet as the feet of a bear,and his mouth as the mouth of a lion(actually it refers the roots of this satanic Gentile Beast- Daniel 7:4-6, yeah, to him the false messiah-the dragon-Rev.13:11-,will give his Power, and his Seat(in Jerusalem, where is the Throne of Satan),and great Authority-Rev.13:2,and Power will be given unto the MAN Beast of sea-to the last of the Popes or Papacy,for forty and two months- Revelation 13:5.By the way,this period of 42 months ruled by the last Pope sat in the Throne of the false messiah in Jerusalem is the FIRST HALF of the last week-week 70th, Daniel 9:27,so Catholicism(iron)and the esoteric and kabbalistic Judaism(the clay)both will be together to establish an Universal and satanic religious kingdom,and then will LITERALLY be fulfilled what my Lord JESUS prophesied: "...and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles(with the Pope enthroned in Jerusalem by the false messiah),until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled-that is the fullness of the Gentiles"- Luke 21:24 combined with Revelation 11:2
Get ready
We are in the "Church Age" at this point; and heading toward the final version of the "Revived Roman Empire" as seen in Daniel 2:42-44. The final composite kingdom of the Antichrist is like a lion (Babylonian symbol but modern day Great Britain); a bear (Media Persian symbol also Russia) a leopard (fitting into the Greek or Mediterranean Kingdom); and the final composite Beast of the last days which encompasses the entire earth ( Daniel 7:2-8). This will come eventually with the Antichrist for "one hour" (probably the 7 Year Tribulation) taking over a kingdom of 10 Kings who are yet to have a kingdom ( Revelation 17:12).
Since nations are still mentioned in verses about the Millennium ( Psalm 86:9 as one example) coming to the Lord it is clear they are in God's design to be restored. For now; territorial integrity is important; although God will have to settle many disputes when He comes ( Isaiah 2:4).
God has established through the Abrahamic covenant and other promises to Joshua and Caleb that He would give the 12 Tribes inheritance of all the territory described from the "Great Sea" to the Euphrates ( Joshua 1:4). God does honor covenants though; so agreements made with those in other nations or even Israel itself say with settlements should be honored.
We also need to keep in mind Joshua 5:14 where the Angel of the Lord states He is for the Lord's army not necessarily siding with anyone. This is why God allowed Israel's enemies to prosper at times for chastisement; as was made clear in God's prophecies about Babylon and even the pagan invaders stated this (although I can't find the verse at present). It is humbling to think about this at present; we in our proud nation think the worst thing to happen would be invasion from another nation and submission but are we better than Israel and the Babylonians? This may happen before the Tribulation if He tarries (our borders are already breached BTW). Food for thought.
We must also understand that there are those predestined to be in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world ( Ephesians 1:3-6). The opposite is true for the unregenerate as seen in Revelation 17:8. Christ's death was therefore part of a plan from before Creation where all those would hear His voice who were His sheep ( John 10:27). We must remember that His death was effective from what happened in time and space 2000 years ago. It also is retroactive; as it were in order to allow those who were of old to eventually in time and space have access to heaven (see Romans 6:9). Therefore; at the Rapture ( 1 Thess. 4:15) shall involve the Resurrection of all souls of deceased saints; followed by bodily ascension of those alive and remaining. There are some verses which seem to indicate O.T. saints may arise later on in say the Midpoint of the Tribulation or near the end; there is some debate on that question. Some already apparently were resurrected ( Matt. 27:52-56). This would have been a gleaning of the firstfruits; so to speak.
My point here is predestination and the fact that God initiates repentance ( Acts 11:18); etc. There is such a thing as godly repentance and worldly ( 2 Cor. 7:10); illustrated by that of Peter and Judas Iscariot. Genuine repentance brings life and brings sorrow at offending a Holy God; worldly sorrow only is interested in consequences of our actions; and in Judas' case he only recognized Christ as having "innocent blood"; not as God's Son to be worshipped.
Jesus said Yes! Matthew 24
Starting from the Destruction of Jerusalem in 70 c.e.
until he comes. Then there's God's Wrath coming against Satan the Devil (the Dragon, Serpent REV. chapter 12), Wild beast (Authorities, Kings, HORNS chapter 17,18), and False Religion (Babylon the Great, Prostitute Revelation 17:1-6; Revelation 20:1,10)
Revelation 17 spoken in illustration then the angel explains
Revelation 18 spoken in illustration how powerful Babylon the great is (False Religion:The Great City)
Revelation 22 spoken partly in illustration and then true talk at the end
Rather it's believed or not, the scriptures (The law passed from Heaven Psalm 83:18) has spoken. 2 Peter 1:20,21
Only time will tell