Discuss Revelation 5 Page 6

THE FIRST RESURRECTION: The seventh trumpet resurrection happens in the twinkling of an eye. ( 1 Corinthians 15:51-52) Judgment for these resurrected Christians takes place in the space between the seventh trumpet and before the twinkling, rather simultaneously.

The 144,000 out of great tribulation are judged ( Revelation 20:4) and made whole. These are the elect only, no others. Resurrection scriptures were tailored for the elect, of the great tribulation, who rise first.

The resurrection accounts of the 144,000 are on record, and their numbers add up: "10,000 x 10,000 = 100,000 + thousands and thousands" is another way of saying 144,000. ( Revelation 7:9 [that's them]) ...a great multitude...in white robes...out of the great tribulation. ( Revelation 11:12)

( Revelation 5:11) And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands.

( Revelation 7:13-14) And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes (fifth seal brethren) and whence came they?....they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes...

It makes sense for the 144,000 to rule the world with Christ for the 1,000 years. Then bring up the balance for the new heaven and new earth.

For resurrection perspective, the current world population is 7.8 billion people.

Conservatively speaking, 25 billion Christians have lived since the first century AD.

If these 25 billion dead in Christ are resurrected at the last trumpet, where will they go?

25 billion (physically) are not sustainable, suggesting that the first fruits are a small body of the core church. Many will remain asleep.

THE SECOND RESURRECTION: God's balance of 108 billion souls will come to the table. ( Ecclesiastes 12:7) The new earth & new heaven will accommodate all.

satan's spiritual relationship with antichrist parallels that of God to Jesus.

-God's Spirit is counterfeited by satan spirit

-Jesus' Spirit is counterfeited by antichrist spirit

-Holy Ghost is counterfeited by the false prophet spirit

1) Jesus's ministry was 42 months

To: ( Revelation 13:5) antichrist receives 42 months

2) ( Revelation 1:8)

To ( Revelation 17:8)

3) ( Revelation 5:6)

To: ( Revelation 13:3)

The three evil spirits that God had stricken us with, to prove us, are gone. ( Revelation 16:13) ( Revelation 19:20) ( Revelation 20:10). It is the dragon (satan) the boss that gets locked up for 1,000 years..

Below is conclusive "mirroring" evidence of the spirit world hierarchy:

( Daniel 8:24) And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.

"but not by his own power" as that power comes from the dragon, given from God.

( Revelation 13:2) And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

"the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority". satan gives power to antichrist, antichrist is the son of satan, but antichrist is not satan. antichrist is under the possession of satan.

( Titus 2:13) Many scriptures point to Jesus being God, but this hierarchy evidence can't be overlooked. Jesus told his adversaries all along who he was, but they didn't have the wherewithal to grasp it, Jesus continually said His power was not of His own, but of the Father. The theologians argue this paradox out to contention.

( John 5:19) ...The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do....

( John 12:49) For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me....

Natalie, may CHRIST IN US grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.

The word of God is a mystery; it is a HIDDEN treasure. What appears to be natural most often has a HIDDEN meaning.

Psalms 133:2 IT (the oil; the higher meaning is the HOLY SPIRIT) is like the precious ointment (when some one was called to do God's work they had their heads anointed with oil; which was the Holy Spirit, the WORKS OF GOD were performed by them through the power of the HOLY SPIRIT) that ran down on the beard; even Aaron's beard (Aaron was anointed as a high priest (but the true meaning is; Christ was always chosen to be our HIGH PRIEST, Aaron's beard is CHRIST): that (the oil, the anointing,the HOLY SPIRIT) went down to the skirts of his garments (WE ARE CHRIST GARMENTS; the anointing has come down to us; to make us PRIEST UNTO GOD)

Revelation 5:10 And (CHRIST) hast made us unto our God kings and priest, and we shall reign on earth.

Patricia, may the Spirit grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.

Revelation 4:6

The four living creatures before the throne is ALL OF CREATION.

God made a covenant with NOAH AND ALL CREATION that God would never again destroy CREATION.

Genesis 9:9-12

The covenant was with man, fowl, cattle and beast.

Revelation 4:7 And the first beast (living creature) was like a lion (BEAST), and the second beast (living creature) like a calf (CATTLE), and the third beast had the face of A MAN ( Revelation 13:18), and the fourth beast (living creature) was the face of an eagle (FOWL).

Ezekiel 1:10 As for the likeness of their faces, they four had the face of A MAN, and the face of a lion (BEAST), on the right side: and they four had a face of an ox (CATTLE) on the left side, they four had also the face of an eagle (FOWL).

ALL CREATION WILL WORSHIP GOD ( Revelation 4:8) ( Revelation 5:13) ( Revelation 15:4)

Revelation 5 .12

Saying with a loud voice , Worthy is the lamb that was slain to receive power , and riches , and wisdom , and strength, and glory , and blessing.

Read the chapter and understand what heaven thinks about Jesus the lambs accomplishments.

These are the highest rewards .

John,

Yes, God is indeed a merciful God. One way to fully understand how merciful God is would be to read through Revelation during the time where God is pouring out judgment on an unbelieving world. If you notice as you read along, the judgment comes in phases. And each phase gets progressively worse than the last. Do you think God's not trying to get their attention during each phase and giving them the opportunity to repent? It's like God is saying, "Look, I'm giving you the opportunity to repent and turn to me.

But even after going through this, many will still not repent. God could have just wiped out the entire unbelieving world immediately but He does not do so. Why? I believe, as you appropriately state, he is merciful. His judgment comes in stages or phases. Even during the time of His wrath, He's giving people an opportunity to repent. Now that's what I would call mercy!

I know that god is merciful but i didn't know that he was that merciful

Thanks Earl!.

That Made me think of "The Restitution of all things""

Acts 3:18-21.

But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.

Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

Whom the heaven must receive until the times of RESTITUTION OF ALL THINGS, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

It's Interesting I think the Kinsman Redeemer is also the revenger of blood also.

But as a Interesting side note,

There's three places sought out to find a ""Man"" that was Worthy to Redeem what some Scholars call the title deed of the Earth, "Seal Book written on both sides"

( Here we are in Revelation ch 5 and the tribulation have not even started and we see ""Man"" Sought out IN HEAVEN!! Not only that suggest we'll go to Heaven but also it seems like the RAPTURE has already taken place!!!)

Revelation 5:3. AND NO MAN IN HEAVEN, NOR IN EARTH, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

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And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne.

And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.

And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast """REDEEMED""" us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

As we see here in Revelation 5:2-3. ( They sought out a worthy "MAN" to open the sealed book ) :And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?

And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

You had to be born of a woman, you see a picture of kinsman redeemer in the book of Ruth with Boaz.

I hope that helps.

HI Sacha,

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That is a great question and important topic that you are inquiring about, "He chose to have His Son born of a human woman who by her fleshly nature is sinfull ,do you think there might have been a reason for this choice ?" And you also mentioned the seed of the woman which ties to this,

If I'm understanding the question as presented I think the study we are looking for is a study in

( KINSMAN REDEEMER).

Jesus was born of a woman to become our kinsman redeemer.

Galatians 4:4-5. But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Hebrews 2:9-11.

But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,

Roman 8:3.

For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son " IN THE ''''LIKENESS"'' of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Revelation 5:2-5.

And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?

And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

In the 14th verse of Rev. 5 what does it mean when it says "and worshipped Him that liveth forever and ever? " Doesn't everyone live forever and ever?

My brother Steven,

Hopefully you know I have not the answer to your question nor do I believe anyone else does. Saying how they go to heaven if by the blood of Christ? Well animals don't have sin, as humans do, so I believe they are on a different scale than us. Of coarse this is just my opinion. I agree our concern should most definitely be for other souls of people rather than bugs.

Still, I believe animals are a beautiful creation of our Father and carry His finger print. Seeing butterflies, dogs, birds flying and singing would be beautiful in Heaven. To me. But as said I guess there is only one way to find out the truth. It is all up to God.

Revelation 5:13 - And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, [be] unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

As this verse states every "creature" which is in Heaven. Could it merely mean just Angels with humans? Or animals also? God knows and one day we will too my brother.

God Bless.

Revelation 20:4 - And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and [I saw] the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received [his] mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Revelation 20:1-15 - And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. (Read More...)

Revelation 20:7 - And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Isaiah 2:2-4 - And it shall come to pass in the last days, [that] the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. (Read More...)

Isaiah 65:25 - The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust [shall be] the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.

Matthew 19:28 - And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Zechariah 8:3 - Thus saith the LORD; I am returned unto Zion, and will dwell in the midst of Jerusalem: and Jerusalem shall be called a city of truth; and the mountain of the LORD of hosts the holy mountain.

Zechariah 14:16 - And it shall come to pass, [that] every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

Revelation 5:10 - And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Daniel 2:44 - And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never b

My personal belief is that one can pray to both God & His Son Jesus Christ. Even though I generally address God my Father in prayer, I also find that I can speak to Jesus, to thank Him & praise Him. Why I say this is because in our new relationship with the Godhead, God is our Father & Jesus is our Brother. Just as one would seek the help & advice from an earthly father & maybe the understanding & support of an earthly brother, we can even see God & His Son in a similar way, praying to them, praising them, & seeking help. And we should also be able to pray to the Holy Spirit residing in us, especially in those times of trial & testing or for strength & comfort.

As well, we see in Scripture that people prayed to Jesus. You can look at these verses: 1 Corinthians 1:1,2 (calling upon the Lord Jesus' Name); 2 Corinthians 12:8,9 (Paul's thorn in the flesh); John 9:38 (Jesus was worshipped); Revelation 5:8-13 (Jesus worshipped in Heaven as God is); Acts 7:59; Acts 9:6 & many more.

And No, you don't need to speak in other tongues to experience re-birth. Re-birth is effected by God's Spirit as soon as you realize that you're a sinner & that the only hope of your forgiveness & salvation is by coming to the Cross of Christ where He gave His Life in your place. Once you repent of your sins, calling upon the Name of the Lord ( Romans 10:13), God hears your prayer (because it was He by His Spirit that drew you to this point of anguish & need to be saved). And 'all who come to Him He will in no wise cast away, or reject' ( John 6:37). God then indwells you by His Spirit making you a new woman with a clean heart with new & holy desires to please Him with your life. His Spirit also gives us gifts, some to speak with new tongues, & other gifts ( 1 Corinthians 12:7-11. Also see verses 28-31), but to speak in other languages is not a requirement or proof of your rebirth experience & of the Holy Spirit in you. A changed life, heart, will & true love for all, characterize a Christian.

Hello Bob,

That is correct. I don't have a problem with people saying Jesus is God.

If you do then that's your issue. As my post was only to make peace. I do not call Jesus Christ the Father. Lots of other people do though so it's them you quarrel with I guess. I say the Father is in Jesus Christ and He in the Father. Just as our Lord states in John 14:10.

Yes the Father has authority over all. But you seem to put Jesus Christ on our level? God our Father has given all His authority to His Son Jesus Christ. He has all the power of the Father. You said to someone else "I agree that Jesus and the Father are One". How you interpret that is up to you.

Jesus Christ is the exact representation of the Father. As in Hebrews 1:2-3. God our Father is Spirit not human.

Yes I also would say Jesus Christ is at the right hand of the Father. I would also say the Father has given Him a throne also. Matthew 28:18, Matthew 25:31, Revelation 3:21

A couple verses showing the Oneness of God and Christ. Revelation 5:13, Revelation 22:1, Revelation 22:3

God Bless you.

Using the Search Engine to Find Answers on Isaiah 54.

Know what? If we got a new video game we'd be awake 24/7, figuring out how to play it. Another 2 years trying to beat the game (including Time spent on YouTube watching cheats and tricks).

We're all over the place trying to Beat That Game!!!

Tell me why we don't go at the Bible the same way?? Dig, dig deeper, read commentaries on here, read commentaries on Google.

The Holy Spirit is your TEACHER. Ask Him. If you'll sit still long enough and be quiet, you will get answers.

PRAY for a TEACHABLE spirit.

They're not cheats; but your Bible will start speaking to your spirit.

Get a Study Bible that has Center of Each page, reference columns: with the abc notes within the scriptures. Those send you to other scriptures that EXPAND the meanings or reveal a prophesy.

Back out of the room to the Search Box.

Put a scripture in it or just a word (like worms) hit the arrow. The search engine will pull up all verses with 'worms' in it.

Touch or click the verse and it will highlight yellow.

Scroll downward to the Commentary Box. Click that. It will show you what the scholars interpret that scripture to mean.

Questions answered. It makes studying fun and interesting.

Be adventurous.

There's a quickie link from KJV to Google to help you find a scripture you're unsure about. Like: "Jesus releasing prisoners from hell".

Learn to study! For yourselves. Share what you find, on here. IT IS FUN! God speaks to us through His Word.

When you sit down to study: pray: I HAVE THE SAME MIND OF CHRIST !! I receive it by faith right now. God watches over His Word To Perform it.

Habakkuk 2:2-4 find your identity in the Bible.

LEARN how to use the Tools to get your questions answered sooner. Let's rejoice that we have them! Old Testament saints didn't have Bibles. Have courage.

Mishael

What are the seven spirits of God, referenced in Revelations chap5 verse 6.

Where did the 24 elders come from? Those that were spoken of in the book of Revelaton?Were they from the earth?

That's a good observation & worthy of consideration, Maria. In Revelation 1:10, we see John being found "in the spirit on the Lord's Day" & then in the next verse, Jesus tells him, "What thou seest write in a book".

I have always imagined that the Lord wanted John to see & learn things of Heaven & of future events, & what he saw should be published for the benefit of the "seven Churches", which of course comes as a pressing warning & concern to us today. So I see John caught up in a 'trance', not as in the occult or Hinduism, where human faculties are overpowered by spirits, but in a Holy Spirit induced vision of the 'other world & of Earth's future'. If John's spirit left his body to enter Heaven, you would be right to assume that he faced a temporary 'death', but I somehow don't see that as what happened here.

And in that vision, he was given all that the Lord Jesus wanted to reveal to him & subsequently to reveal to us. He not only heard the Voice of Jesus, but saw in graphic detail (with imagery) the events that "would shortly come to pass" ( Rev 1:1). So I don't see John spiritually or physically in Heaven, but the vision given to Him was so real (as when one has a vivid dream prior to waking up), that he must have believed he was standing before the Lord. What an experience, which one day will be ours.

An observation:

Revelation 5: Did John leave his body at Patmos & went up in his spirit when he saw the throne? Did he entered heaven???? If so, then his body with no spirit would be left lifeless & would later come back to his body & return to life. Or was He filled with the spirit & had a vision of the throne through the open door & saw the revelation of things to come from the scrolls but was not actually in heaven???

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Revelation 4:2: yes, that does show John viewing One sitting on the Throne, but when you read further in Revelation 5:6-9, we also see Jesus (God's Word sent to be made human, but now ascended to sit at God's right Hand). And we know that Jesus & God are there in Heaven by this verse & also Romans 8:34. So God's Word was made flesh & called "Jesus" but raised as 'God Who is also Man' in that Body fitted for Heaven, even as we shall be in that day ( 1 John 3:2). And yes, it was God's Plan from the beginning to have His children enjoy intimate fellowship with Him. And God is His Fullness (i.e. the Father, His Son & His Spirit Who are God in Unity) do enjoy such fellowship with His children. Each cannot feel differently about us (i.e. God cannot have fellowship with us, but the Son says "But I don't like that person, let's have a chat about this Father"). God is One & that Oneness is seen in His expressions of His Son & His Spirit & in their Unity & complete agreement.

Jesus as a 'created Being': Jesus' Sacrifice as a Man does indeed have spiritual consequences but cannot be seen as a spiritual Sacrifice. He was fully human & fully God, yet laying aside some of those Divine qualities for the purposes of the Incarnation & Sacrifice ( Philippians 2:5-11). To enable us to be convicted, to draw us to repentance, to give light & understanding, to renew us & fill us, to sanctify us & to raise us up to the heavenlies, is the work of God's Spirit. And Who is this Spirit? The self same Spirit that is part of the Father & the Son.

1 John 3:9: that's a separate subject that can be discussed if you desire, as its meaning needs analysis. Though the concept of sinless perfection is concerning. Blessings.

God created Adam and Eve with enough genetic information within themselves to eventually bring about the many differences we now see in people. Actually there is only one race, human, with many families, tribes and nations. As time passed and people multiplied, small variations became greater. Different combinations of genetic information were enhanced by unique contributions from each parent to the next generation.

In Genesis 10, after the flood, we read that the whole earth was populated by the descendants of Shem, Ham and Japheth, the three sons of Noah. By that time in history, each of their beautiful wives must have had strikingly different appearances.

In Genesis 11, the LORD confounds the speech of the people in response to their building the tower of Babel. This caused them to scatter into separate tribes and nations which by separation would naturally bring about even greater differences in genetic characteristics.

And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth. And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne. And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints. And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. ( Revelation 5:6-10)

Yes indeed: it's the Living Word of God, i.e. the words are from God & they come alive to our hearts so we can know God & His Purposes for us. Keep reading, Sanaytrah, asking God to help you understand & to apply it to your life where needed. It contains the words of life - words that tell us how to come out of the darkness of our minds & hearts, into His glorious Light & to the saving of our souls. May you enjoy reading it & come to understanding of its message for you.

Thank you for your reply. Your answer clearly clarified my question.

No man , are those who have been washed in the blood of Christ. There is a diff. between no one , and or no man. No one includes even unbelievers who are not washed in the blood of Christ. Believers in the Lord Jesus Christ and are not included in ( no one) . No one is just that, meaning no one. Non existent before God! Satan will do anything to discredit the word of God! He knows he is going to hell, and will stand even before the throne of grace trying to discredit the glory and judgment of God! These things belong to the spirit of God, which are in those, who trust and believe in the atoning blood of Jesus Christ. I would only suggest that you not compare other interpretations of scripture with God's Holy Word!

In verse 3 it states no man. Other books say no one what is that word man in Greek or Hebrew represent

Worthy is the lamb

Patience you speak of is before us, waiting for us! Thank you for your words!

It's much harder to believe there is no God, than it is to open your eyes and look around at things.

Romans 1

whats your take on atheists