Bible Discussion Thread

Trying to outsmart the Devil: Man's way or God's way

When we hear "deliverance" preachers calling for a demon to go back to hell; or go there the first time clearly we are taking liberties the scriptures won't allow us to do. The demons asked Jesus at the time He was casting them out not to send them to the abyss before the time.

A lack of clear understanding of what the problem of man is comes from titles such as a "demon of lust" etc that somehow is supposed to describe the personality of an entity. There is no doubt; of course that certain illnesses (such as a mute boy) describe a demon and its effects. Not understanding the sin nature; however puts us in danger that if the house isn't cleaned out; as it were a demon after going out brings in 7 more wicked ones. Pride; for instance can replace lust; or alcohol as a vice.

This "one sided" approach to Satan negates the fact that he has many methodologies to meet his goals; and it also doesn't get to the source of the issue; our sin nature which gives Satan legal access to some extent to accuse us; oppress and in some cases at least for nonbelievers possess them with his minions.

This again relates to the whole concept of trying to have a political crusade married to a religious one. God rules over all; but the world system in all its institutions has deep roots in our nation as well as others; whether we choose to admit it or not. To appeal to the masses an ecumenical concept has to reign supreme and there is no doubt that is going to lead to the Babylon religion and economic world system. The deception is that one party or another is the problem. And a lack of REPENTANCE characterizes this whole concept. To bring in the masses we need a lukewarm watered down approach to God's Word which inevitably involves "inclusivity"; and has an appearance of change that is illusory. We all need to be wise as serpents and innocent as doves. Satan is; as I like to say an "equal opportunity" destroyer

Hello Richard,

I agree with you. Those who claim to have deliverance ministries are often so flamboyant in their ministry which brings attention to themselves. Why would they need to resort to such dramatic demonstrations if their work is truly from God?

And as far as how they often speak to demons, they ignore what is said in Jude 1:8 says of the archangels who tells Satan "the Lord rebuke you". When they tell demons where to go and speak ill of them, they are not following Scripture and show that they really do not understand how much power and authority these truly possess. Only Jesus is more powerful and possesses more authority than evil entities. We should beseech the Lord to help us, to come and deliver a person from demonic influence and be on guard against falling into evil traps set by them who take advantage of some minister's excessive, boastful address to demons themselves. Perhaps more prayer and fasting would actually be what God wants them to do before they try to bring release from evil for others.

Additionally, what you speak about concerning what some people label as demons such as lust, lying, etc. are more likely not actual demons specific to such problematic behavior. These behaviors are the result of our sinful corrupted nature that only wants to sin and to invent knew ways to sin. We must fight against our own nature by the Spirit of the Lord and take responsibility to the rise of besetting behaviors that we tend to feed and allow to grow because we , for one , love them, and secondly, we pass them off as demons when in reality it is just our own self that is bringing these behaviors out in our lives.

It seems that some sections of the charismatic/pentecostal community have driven down deep into this type of thinking to the point where every problem, appetite, character flaw are shouted out as demonic, but they are often not so. We have the Spirit of God living within us and we should walk as if we believe that He is God over demons.

I have seen and heard of some deliverance ministries that are not. But I have seen at least one which was .

I have seen and heard of many claiming to be prophets but are not . But have personally known only one who seemed to fit the profile of an Apistoe but who denied he was one .

For the pattern of an Apostle has to be Paul . I don't expect we shall ever see another Paul but in some measure any claiming to be one must in some measure follow after his pattern .

Though many deny there are any today which might explain the lack of authority and power in the church and depth of biblical foundational teaching .

God is the same yesterday today and forever .

I do not see then or understand how God does not or cannot heal and deliver-as He did of old .

For did not Jesus say " As the father sent me so send I you" and did He not send them out to preach the gospel heal the sick and,.."?

The church has been robbed by charlatans and false Apostles for centuries . It's about time we got back to the scriptures to what they actually say rather than what we think they say .

For the world is going mad and millions are chained to the chariots of the devil .

I object in the strongest terms and protest that the two nations most used of God in the preaching of the gospel and the defence of those true liberties of God are in the state they are in while the church 'celebrates' and very few weep .