Discuss Genesis 1 Page 176

Who is JESUS??? He the Son of GOD or the bible signify the Wisdom of God...in the Book of Proverbs 8:22 is not Christ. He cited 1 Corinthians 1:30 and hastily concluded that Christ is the wisdom for salvation and redemption only, and not the Wisdom instrumental in the creation of every existing thing. Here were his allegations:
A careful look at the above cited verses will reveal to us the following facts —

1. The Wisdom of God is a mystery

2. The hidden Wisdom ordained by God was before the world

3. It was not known by the princes of this world

Due to these, they crucified the Lord of Glory.

The Wisdom of God being mentioned by Paul here is the Wisdom in a mystery, the hidden Wisdom, which is the Lord of Glory. Remember that this Wisdom was ordained by God before the World.
Who is the Lord of Glory?
( James 2:1) “My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.”

It is crystal clear, therefore, that the Wisdom mentioned by Paul who existed and was ordained by God before the world is the Lord Jesus Christ — The Lord of Glory.

It this the same Wisdom being mentioned in the Book of Proverbs?

( 1 Corinthians 1:24) “But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.”

The Apostle Paul said, “The Wisdom of God.” A little knowledge in grammar will teach us know that there is no other Wisdom of God because he used the definite article ‘the.’ However, Christ is the Wisdom of God to those who are called. No wonder, Tumbok does not understand because he was not called. God calls people into the Church of God and not in any church founded by man.

( 1 Corinthians 1:1-2) “Paul called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother, Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours…”

It is in the Church of God that God calls people which He considers worthy of serving Him. If there are those who do not consider Christ as ‘the’ Wisdom of God, they are the enemies of Christ.

( 1 Corinthians 1:23-24) “But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.”

Christ is not the Wisdom of God to those who were not called into the Church of God, but a ‘stumbling block’ and foolishness. Certainly, He is the same Wisdom being mentioned in Proverbs 8:22 —

( Proverbs 8:22) “The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.”

The word ‘possessed’ being used by the Wisdom (referring to Christ) is very much apparent in the declaration of John.

( John 1:18) “No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.”

The Wisdom was possessed by the Father in the beginning of His ways, before His works of old. The succeeding verses, the 23rd and the 24th, prove that He was begotten before anything was made.

( Proverbs 8:23-24) “I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was. When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.”

No other being in the universe was brought forth or begotten of the Father other than the only begotten Son, which was in the beginning, the Wisdom in the bosom of the Father.

( Hebrews 1:5) “For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?”

He is also the Son mentioned in the Book of Proverbs, which was with the Father in the creation of everything.

( Proverbs 30:4) “Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind in his fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son’s name, if thou canst tell?”

He is the person to whom God was speaking, in the creation of man.

( Genesis 1:26) “And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.”

Others conclude (which were always erroneous) that God was speaking to angels; but this is not so. God was speaking to someone who has the same image as He has, and there is no other person in the universe or beyond it, that has the exact image of God other than the Son.

( Hebrews 1:1-3) “God who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high…”

Note that by the Son he made the worlds. The Son is the express image of His person. These reasonings of Saint Paul jive with the preaching of John in his gospel.

( John 1:1-3) “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”

To sum up, that Jesus Christ really is the Wisdom of God being mentioned in the Book of Proverbs, let us look at the verses a second time.

( Proverbs 8:22-30) “The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was. When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water. Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth: While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world. When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth: When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep: When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth: Then I was by him, as one brought up with him: and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him…”

I have highlighted in red words and phrases that speak of the time element proving that the Wisdom, that is the Son, pre-existed before He was born of Mary in the form of a man. There is no other Wisdom of God being mentioned in the Bible, other than the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ; the Lord of Glory, the wisdom that God used in the creation of everything that exists.

( Colossians 2:2-3) “That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ; In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.”

All treasures of wisdom and knowledge are in Christ. The Apostle Paul has known this so he wrote —

( Colossians 1:15-17) “Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.”

How can something that does not exist be made an instrument in the creation of everything that exists? That is impossible!

( John 1:1-3) “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”

The Son was there in the Creation of everything! Without Him was not anything made that was made!

Good work
When I am out side and hear and feel the wind!
I think of God blew breath into His creation(adam)
and man became a liveing soul. Made Heaven and earth. I am building a stone wall out of rock and I am in awe of the colors of Gods creation.

From where did all the water come?

Gen.1:6-8 defines "the firmament" as "heaven", which I think means atmospheric heaven (not outer space, not Heaven-God's throne place.)
Gen 1:6-8 describes "waters above the firmament" and "waters under the firmament".
Therefore I should visualize waters above the atmospheric heaven, much more than clouds.

Then in Genesis 7,

Genesis 1:6-8 "And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which [were] under the firmament from the waters which [were] above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day."

Elements of Genesis 1:6-8:
"firmament" is "Heaven". Seems to me that this means the atmospheric heaven.
1. "Waters which were above the firmament": seems to be signficant water up there, more than modern day clouds.
2. "waters which were under the firmament": seems to be surface waters plus subterranean water.

Then the water in Genesis 7 came from both places:
2. "were all the fountains of the great deep broken up" (some of the waters below the firmament),
1. "and the windows of heaven were opened" (the windows let through the waters from above the firmament).

What do you think?

AMEN for the comments from Isias and Gaylord.

regarding to our brothers questions of whether god had been existing , or there is another god who created him,no human being could answer their questions except they have their faith in god. they will say yes god exist ever since, but to this modern times that we usually rely on what we observe ,or to see is to belive attitude,we'll surely be confused,but maybe I can give you some idea, Can you see the air that we breath? Can yiou see when it is blowing on the east or west ,yet we know that air is present because without that we wont live,the same with god we will not see him exist yet ,we have the idea about his existence,we can feel it through our hearts , belivers have strong belief that GOD really exist before anything else had been created . no power whatsoever or anything ,anyone created him.God only knows his unpredictable existence ,we doeS not know him but he knows us , HE IS A MASTER BUILDER AND THE CEMENT HAS NO RIGHT TO ASK WHAT THE BUILDER WOULD DO TO HIM.ONLY GOD KNOWS BEST, AND BESIDES THIS BEATIFULL AND PERFECT THINGS THAT WE SEE IS NOT MAYBE CREATED BY CHANCE, THERE MUST BE A GREAT GOD CREATED THEM.INCLUDING HIMSELF? YES,BECAUSE I BELIVE IN GOD,WHATEVER IT TAKES.

I'm older than my son and younger than my Father. Pity you can't here truth. Is.9:6 for unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon His shoulder: and His name shall be called Wonderful,Counsellor,The Mighty God, The Everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. NOW, John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word,and the Word was with God,and the Word WAS God. Isaiah 45:21 Tell ye,and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? Who hath told it from that time? Have not I the LORD? And there is NO God else beside me; a just God and A Saviour; there is none beside Me. And I say, JESUS is LORD! Through His Name of Jesus gives me His acceptance,my credentials, because I believe that My God Loved me and died for my sins for me on that Cross and rent the veil of the room of the Holy Room so that I, through His name of Jesus, can speak directly to Him, my Father. As it is written in ( Matthew 27:51) now, and forever I say, I need no man to show me the way, if I need to be shown I will ask my Father through Jesus Name too show me the Way. But hey, if you can help me understand more by your comments I like to listen. Some of the ones I read are really good and it keeps me learning and looking through the Word.

May. All I am saying is my bible contains NO contradictions. It is the word of God, period.

Joe- Pity I don't need, answers I do need. I'd like to know what you mean by "going in every different direction" and "jumping from text to text". The chapters and verses I quoted, are fact. Or is it just mistakes written in the Bible. Whatever it is Joe, you have to admit it makes you wonder if the clear verses are condradictions or mistakes that man have written themselves. You yourself need to open your eyes. The writtings are so clear even an Intelligent child will pick it up. I do believe in our Almighty God, the creator of the universe, heavens and all thats in between. It is God and God alone we need to give thanks too and praise him each moment of everyday and night for the blessings he has bestowed on us, to prostate in prayer as he commanded Abraham, Moses and every prophet to do. Genesis 17:3 And Abram fell on his face: and God talked with him, saying," Exodus 34:8 And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped. Joshua 5:14 And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship, and said unto him. Matthew 17:6 And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid. Matthew 26:39 And he (Jesus) went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed.
To give elms to the poor. Proverbs 28:27
He who gives to the poor will lack nothing, but he who closes his eyes to them receives many curses. Luke 14:12-14
Jesus advised hosts to invite the poor to their banquets because then God would bless them.
God is great

May. I actually pity you. You are going in every different direction to prove the bible is inconsistent or contradictory. Either you believe in the inspired word of God, or you don't. I don't have answers to your "perceived" contradictions, because it is obvious you are jumping from text to text, and taking things out of context. This does not convince me of anything except that I still believe God's word completely. If I agreed with only the parts I liked, then what would be the use in reading the bible in the first place. You can't have your cake and eat it too. It's all or nothing. May HE give you "eyes to see" and "ears to hear" his Holy word. Blessings.

Garyloyd Newman: Obviously you are only writing what you've been told, not what you have read. Just out of curiosity Garyloyd how old are you. I am asking because what you have written does not make sense at all. Don't preach what you don't know nothing about.

Mohammed was just a man with an idea to get wealth/power just like preachers today send ur money I can get you blessed or healed. The Prophets/Apostles ended in 95AD or when John died. End of the story,God said it all and anything else until the two witnesses show up. A mans actions determine his worth. Some men and their ideas are good and some evil. I study Gods letter to his children. When I get before the Judge there won't be anyone between me and God cause no one can save your soul but God.

Mathew, Did Jesus claim to be God if so where are those actual words written. Why I'm asking this question is because I have some quotes where Jesus says otherwise.
Mathew 5:17-18 "Don't misunderstand why I have come, I did not come to abolish the law of Moses or the writings of the prophets, No I came to accomlish their purpose".
Mathew 15:24 "I was sent only to help Gods lost sheep, the people of Isräel".
John 8:28 "I do nothing of my own, but say only what the Father taught me and the one who sent me is with me, he has not deserted me".
Jesus prophesied that people will worship him uselessly and believe in doctrines not made by God but by man.
Mathew 15:8-9 "BUT IN VAIN DO THEY WORSHIP ME, TEACHING FOR DOCTRINES THE COMMANDMENT OF MEN".
So to you Chuck the answer is NO Jesus is not in Genisis.

Joe: If you have read the Bible you surely would have picked the condradiction's up. However if you haven't then I will enlighten you. Let me just say that the references that I'm about to quote may not be in your Bible as there are many Bibles available on the market that are used by different Christian sects each claiming that their Bible is translated as the word of God.The references I will quote comes from the Tyndale Bible.
Jeremiah 8:8
"How can you say we are wise because we have the the word of the Lord, when your teaches have twisted it by writing Lies"
The Condradiction's In the Bible start from;
In 2 Samuels 8:4 it reads
"David captured 1700 charioteers and 20,000 foot solders, he crippled all the chariots except enough for 100 chariots".
Now read
1 Chronicles 18:4
"David captured 1000 chariots, 7000 charioteers and 20,000 foot solders. He crippled all the chariots horses except for 100 chariots".
Other examples are;
2 Samuels 8:9-10
1 Chronicles 18:9-10

2 Kings 8:26
2 Chronicles 22:2

2 Samuels 6:23
2 Samuels 21:8

Genisis 6:3
Genisis 9:29

John 5:37
John 14:9

John 5:31
John 8:14
You see Jo All doctrines of modern Christianity are made by man. They are definitely not quotes from the bible For example;
The Trinity, Divine Son ship Of Jesus Christ, Original sin and atonement.
Jesus as he says in
John 8:28 "I do nothing of myself"
John 14:28 "My father is greater than I"
Mark 12:29 "The Lord is ONE lord"
Mark 13:32 "No one knows the day or hour when these things will happen not even the angles in heaven or the SON himself, ONLY THE FATHER KNOWS"
The word Trinity is not Biblical nor is it used in any Bibles or Bible dictionaries. Trinity was never specifically mentioned by Jesus. The formation of the word "Trinity"was presented by Athenasius, an Egyptian Deacon from Alexandria and was accepted by the council of Nicea more than three centuries after Jesus had departed from this earth.
Other such "Man made" decisions of the council contributed to the declaration of the Roman Sunday as the Christian Sabbath, and the establishment of December 25th as Jesus birthday. This was done in order to have a celebration that occurred on the same day as the birthday of the pagan gods such as Nimrod (Babylon god) Krishna, (Hindus god), Mithra (Greek god) and Dionysius (Bacchus of greece)who is named the only begotten son of Jupiter and was born of the virgin mother Demeter, on the 25th of December. As you can see the celebration of the birth of Jesus is clearly an idea of pagan decent. As clear as we can read in black and white the Bible forbids even the decoration of christmas trees;
Jeremiah 10:3-4 "Their ways are fertile and foolish. They cut down a tree and a craftsman carves an idol". "They decorate it with gold and silver and than fasten it securely with hammer and nails so it won't fall over".
The conclusions to my recent research on religion is that we so called true Christians are not even close to abiding by Gods laws, far from it. We are such Hippocrates.
I hope this helps Jo, May God give you blessings

Only way for evolution to work is if it was an on going process. That's why science decided darwin was wrong. Think about it. Its a no brainer. We would have to have half monkey, half men walking around and that's why its not the thing to believe. Even scientist know and most Believe in God.

Mohammed murdered Christian right? Read the koran, a bunch of religious mumbo jumbo and twisted knowledge. Evil wisdom and junk to anyone wanting to get to the true Way to heaven. The muslim told me mohammed its another way to get to heaven. I laught. Hitler still has followers. Mohammed to. Both killed Jews and Christian. The last dispensation of whom is in controll of the Mount. The feet are the mohammedians/muslims. The Stone will strike and bring the statue down. I need no other Way or Word or Letter from my Father than the one He sent. I follow no man who played god and won't follow any one wanting to follow any man who made up a bunch of mumbo jumbo. Don't add or take away from Father`s Letter. Why even read it Father Himself told us not to that there is only one Holy Bible. A Christian. Go preach your koran to the dead at koran.dead.

Jesus was in the garden. Tree of life. Read Johns writting. In the beginning was the word and the word was God and created everything. He was the One who said let us create man in OUR image. He didn't leave Himself out. God wouldn't send His children here if He wouldn't come Himself.

Mona. What and where in the bible are your concerns that there are contridictions? If the bible is the inspired word of God, there cannot be any contridictions by definition.

To Chuck: According to the bible Jesus, God, and the Holy Spirit are one. This three in one is called the trinity. In Genesis 1:1, it says God created the heaven and the earth. Jesus does not have to be mentioned because they are not talking of the earthly form of God or Jesus that came through the process of incarnation through the holy virgin birth of Mary (a sinner), then went to the cross, died for sins of all men, rose again on the third day, and shortly after over 500 people witnessed Jesus risen, he ascended into heaven. Hopefully that answers your question!

Mona- wow!! I have to say I was blown away with your comments for such a long time I have been trying to seek the truth and understand what our Almighty God wanted from us meer humans. Multi questions which no-one could give me a answer. The main reason I started asking questions was because I found so many condradictions in the bible that even I kmow that if you read any book and find the slightest condradiction you would throw that book away- right.

Dear. Readers,
Especially Bo , god created a perfectly engineered universe , and the koran talks about genesis in the same way as the bible and the Islam u don't want to be (which u r right) is not what the koran preaches. All religions of the world speak of god almighty and the creator of all. And no religion encourages killing in any shape or form and talks about charity and that void sees and hears everything. What people today who call themselves Muslims are doing is not because they are Muslims. All of us were born into practices of prayers but do we really believe ...? I was like you and looked at nations that call themselves Muslims and i said I don't want to be like them. Then I read the Koran and discovered that non of these nations are practicing the instructions of the Koran and my advice to u is to read it and u will come to the same conclusion. In the koraan Internet is mentioned 1600 years ago. If we read the koran the secrets of the universe are written. But man is too attached to their ancestors religions and practices that they don't open their minds to a book that includes the secrets of the universe . Just like Abraham. As his father told him : my son , your grandfather was worshipping the statues and I worship the statues , why don't u worship the statues? Abraham told him cause god created me and to him I go. And he judges me dooms day.... I wish the world follows Abraham cause he believes in the god almighty without Shia Sunna marinate catholic etc... Open your mind. Be smart and read the Koran. It is a miracle.... And salvation to whom reads it even mother Mary and Jesus Christ are mentioned in stories humans never knew about the miracle of Jesus..... Be smart and read and don't look at the hypocrites that call themselves Muslims and kill in the name of god and the Koran. Cause these are the very enemies of Koran and god
Thank god the Koran is saved in a motherboard in the heaven and what we read is just a display on earth otherwise man would have tampered with it Only the maker of the universe could say that 1600 years. It is written in the Koran. Koran was downloaded on Mohammed and Mohammed had to be totally unlearned so the download is not corrupted... Read the Koran with a clear mind other wise it is too rich for any human to store.... God bless u with his enlightenment . Www.heavenandhell.ws

Is Jesus in Genesis?

Matthew. Thanks for mentioning that very important step I left out. You are right. It is believing AND receiving.

Dear Joe: I agree with you 100% except, but believing that god sent his only son to die on the cross for my sins and all mankind is one thing, but BELIEVING and RECEIVING is the way to Jesus. I know of many historians who believed it happened, but don't accept it as their eternal salvation.

@Joe:
Honestly, I'm not upset or angry. Although I do not "believe", I am a strong supporter of Christianity. Why? Look at what the rest of the world has to offer..Islam? LOL NO! I don't have an issue with most of the core beliefs of Christianity, but as far as it being "true".---No. I'm sorry, but the creation story is a myth. There are many historical truths in the bible, but the creation story is not one of them.

Bo Smith. Please forgive me, but I can tell you are angry and cynical. It's okay. I was there once myself. God made you. There is no other person on earth who ever was, or ever will be like you. You are unique and God's perfect handiwork. But, Bo, you have to make a choice of a lifetime. You have to believe that God sent his only begotten son to die in your place. Please read the book of John. I promise you, it will save your eternal life.

To Derek: Why should i believe evolution when it is not a proven fact and the logic behind it is absurd? Which came first the chicken or the egg? The seed or the fruit? I would love to know. Why aren't there cross fossils between man and animal? Why aren't new and better creatures than humans evolving right now? Why did Darwin himself reject his "theory" ,in his own words, and convert to Christianity? WHY?

Tell me Derek, where is the proof that we evolved? Were you there? Was anyone there? No. And if evolution is such "solid science", then why do so many scientist (who don't profess Christ) not believe in evolution? Uh...maybe because it's a bunch of hogwash that Charles Darwin made up on a whim, wrote it in a book (The Origin of Species), and changed his mind later in life. That's the basis for your belief. Sounds like it's shaky ground, not solid science. And yes, I'll even admit that my belief in creation is a theory, but its foundation is much more reliable than evolution's. The Bible has proved itself time and time again. It's stood the test of time. So go ahead and think what you want of us believers. The difference between me and you:when I die, I'll wake up in Heaven; when you die, you'll be very shocked (and full of regrets) when you wake up in a lake of fire that's burning with fire and brimstone. And for all of eternity, you'll remember the words of all of these people trying to persuade you to believe God and his word.

My final words on the subject. The science of the Bible is nonsense. The Earth is not the center of the universe, the Sun did not stop in the sky for Joshua's battle and yes, we did evolve from lower life forms and it is not a theory but solid science. Look, I know that no one wants to die and certainly does not want to contemplate that death as final so I personally have no problem with individuals clinging to wishful thinking about eternal life. The problem arises when those wishes infringe upon the rights of others and become a basis for inhumane behavior, tax evasion and fraudulent promises to those whose capacity for learning is obscured by their wish for immortality. Believe, have faith, worship, give and face your inevitable death with conviction but at the same time, understand that your evidence, to others, seems weak and trivial, depending solely on the oral tradition of middle eastern authors whose works were woven together by first century hucksters to create the largest business in the history of mankind. The final problem with this business is that it, for thousands of years now, has sought converts and their cash by means that are despicable to enlightened persons. Personally, I hope you are right about eternal life with a benevolent being but it certainly would not be the personage described in scripture as vengeful, given to rage, jealousy, violence with little thought of the individual "child" upon whose woes upon whom they (there are 3 right?) feed, begging for worshipful followers. Good Luck.

God made a statement in Gen. 1:1 then in the 2nd verse the 4th word is "became" not "was" check Isiaih 45:18 created perfect. What happen that He had to restore it and it took 6000 years. Revelation 12 satan the dragon stole a third of Gods children/stars. In the word as in Proverbs 8. Around verse 31? And Job 38 around verse 7? You see the family spoken of as stars,sons of God and let us create man in our image is exact. We are what we are there and same look here. spoken of the world that was and the world that we are on now that has been restored until the LORDs day is in Peter 3 I'm pretty sure? But God created earth and yes with dinosaurs but they couldn't hurt us in that form/body. The dinosuars in Job are behemath drink the whole river jordan and with tails as large cedar trees eat the mountain sides. Space ships are in Ezekiel chapter one. Gods very natural when doing things. He carried His throne Here. But to remember satan as antichrist is going to come and his bunch of preachers will have to ride here so I'm expecting they will return with many flying ships. Don't go flying away. When Christ comes Jerusalem is flatten with hail rocks. Jesus returns with a rod of iron.

It is a fairy tale that the earth was created in 6 days. Anyone who would believe other wise is similar to a martyr thinking they will have 72 virgins after they kill themselves.