Bible Discussion Replies PAGE 57

Credo

Doctrines of man begin with a creed which every sect makes; so did five blind men from Benares. They felt and touched and each sect ended with what an elephant ought to be. Be that as it may here is what I believe from the Word which was God:

God is One as He is the Word,

In his Power and Wisdom we have two entities both work so there is order which is perfect. If Wisdom does not know where to stop what is the use? If it is all power without wisdom it is disaster. So when God maintains this order where both wisdom and power is unified there is glory.

God sent his Son who of His Father has become our salvation.

In the Gospels he is man in all aspects, he felt hunger, felt thirst and when soldiers pierced his side while hanging on the cross he bled; He was a man except he did not sin and knew no sin. In his resurrection he proved he was God.

God sent his Word which we know as the Word which was with God; the word became flesh but we believe by his death and resurrection that he was indeed the word become flesh. By faith we have this anointing that this word in us, abiding in us.

God is One as He is the Word,

In his Power and Wisdom we have two entities both work so there is order which is perfect. If Wisdom does not know where to stop what is the use? If it is all power without wisdom it is disaster. So when God maintains this order where both wisdom and power is unified there is glory.

God sent his Son who of His Father has become our salvation.

In the Gospels he is man in all aspects, he felt hunger, felt thirst and when soldiers pierced his side while hanging on the cross he bled; He was a man except he did not sin and knew no sin. In his resurrection he proved he was God.

God sent his Word which we know as the Word which was with God; the word became flesh but we believe by his death and resurrection that he was indeed the word become flesh. By faith we have this anointing that this word in us, abiding in us.

1 Jn 2,5-6 "God's rest"

How do we enter into this rest? Apostle John summarises in two verses. "But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him./He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked." Keeping his word so the love of God is perfected. This is what the fruit bearing does in th e natural world. Similarly one who is born of incorruptible seed perfects the love of God. As God loved him in his Son, he abides as a branch to the true Vine. This fruit is 'the work' which is natural. v.6 speaks of the condition,-walk even as he walked.'

This Covenant of seven days carries His commandments. The believer by faith is growing from the incorruptible seed 'in our image' where we are conforming to the Law of the Spirit. "he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.". DNA of faith establishes he is indeed the child of God. Second aspect is that we are created 'after our likeness' so if the Son is the true Vine what we produce shall be true to his image and for the glory of his Father. Seth showed he was after our likeness even before Jesus Christ was born. The word of God foretold of the branch. "Hear now, O Joshua the high priest, thou, and thy fellows that sit before thee: for they are men wondered at: for, behold, I will bring forth my servant the BRANCH"(Zech.3.8) This was fulfilled in the case of the Son of man,"And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:"(Isa.11.1) Therefore he is called the son of David, after the flesh.(Mt.1.1) Seth stepped into the breach made by Cain, the wicked one who killed Abel. In his obedience Seth proved that he was after the image of the Son whose obedience owned him a name above every name. "And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross."

(Phi.2.8-11) Thatis how we walk in his obedience, the same Law leads us.

Recap summary.

From a dispensational standpoint, the rapture of the Church ( 1 Thess. 4:13-18; 1 Cor. 15:51-53) concludes the present dispensation of grace. The Body of Christ is removed from earth, meeting Christ in the air and receiving glorified bodies. This ends the "mystery" program revealed to Paul, and God resumes His prophetic dealings with Israel.

With the Church gone, Daniel's 70th week ( Dan. 9:24-27) begins. This seven-year Tribulation is marked by the rise of the Antichrist ( 2 Thess. 2:3-8), covenant dealings with Israel, and severe judgments foretold in Revelation 6-19. God's wrath is poured out through seal, trumpet, and bowl judgments, purging the earth and refining Israel. A believing remnant emerges, while unbelieving nations and Israel face judgment.

At the end of the Tribulation, Christ returns bodily to earth ( Zech. 14:4; Rev. 19:11-16). Unlike the rapture, where He comes for His saints, this is His Second Coming to defeat the Antichrist and establish His kingdom. The battle of Armageddon ( Rev. 16:16; 19:19-21) culminates in His victory, and Satan is bound.

Christ then establishes His millennial reign on earth ( Rev. 20:1-6). Israel's covenants are fulfilled, Jerusalem becomes the center of worship, and nations are blessed through Israel ( Isa. 2:2-4; Jer. 31:31-34). After the 1,000 years, Satan is loosed briefly, defeated, and cast into the lake of fire ( Rev. 20:7-10).

Finally, the Great White Throne judgment occurs ( Rev. 20:11-15), followed by the new heaven and new earth ( Rev. 21-22). God dwells with His redeemed forever.

Grace and Peace.

Pg2

5. The Millennial Kingdom

Christ establishes His 1,000-year reign on earth ( Rev. 20:1-6). Israel's covenants (Abrahamic, Davidic, New Covenant) are fulfilled. Jerusalem becomes the center of worship and rule ( Isa. 2:2-4; Jer. 31:31-34). Nations are blessed through Israel, as prophesied.

6. Final Judgment and Eternal State

After the millennium, Satan is loosed briefly, defeated, and cast into the lake of fire ( Rev. 20:7-10). The Great White Throne judgment follows ( Rev. 20:11-15). Then comes the new heaven and new earth, where God dwells with His redeemed forever ( Rev. 21-22).

Key pointThe rapture removes the Body of Christ before God's wrath, then Israel's prophetic program resumes, leading to Christ's earthly kingdom.

Rightly dividing the scriptures and letting scripture, interpret scripture, completely wholly demonstrates that the church will not go through the tribulation period.

I hope this helps.

Grace and Peace.

Hello Chris,

You hit the nail on the head. Here's the breakdown as I see it

The events following the rapture of the Church (the Body of Christ) are distinct from God's present program of grace revealed to Paul. Here's the sequence as generally understood:

1. The Church Is Removed

The rapture ( 1 Thess. 4:13-18; 1 Cor. 15:51-53) ends the present "dispensation of the grace of God" ( Eph. 3:2). Believers are "caught up" to meet Christ in the air, receiving glorified bodies and removed from the earth before God's wrath. This marks the close of the "mystery" program hidden in God.

2. God's Prophetic Program Resumes with Israel

With the Church gone, God resumes His dealings with Israel under prophecy. Daniel's 70th week ( Dan. 9:24-27) begins. This seven-year period is often called the Tribulation, marked by deception, judgments, and Israel's refining. The focus shifts back to Israel and the nations, not the Body of Christ.

The "man of sin" (Antichrist) is revealed ( 2 Thess. 2:3-8).

Israel enters into covenant dealings, facing persecution and purging ( Matt. 24:15-22).

Prophecies from Daniel, Ezekiel, Zechariah, and Revelation are fulfilled.

3. The Day of the Lord / Tribulation Judgments

God's wrath is poured out on the earth ( Rev. 6-19). This includes seal, trumpet, and bowl judgments. Gentile nations are judged for their treatment of Israel, while unbelieving Israel faces refining. A believing remnant emerges who will inherit the kingdom ( Zech. 13:8-9).

4. Christ's Second Coming

At the end of the Tribulation, Christ returns to earth ( Rev. 19:11-16). Unlike the rapture (where He meets saints in the air), here He descends bodily to the Mount of Olives ( Zech. 14:4). He defeats the Antichrist and his armies at Armageddon ( Rev. 16:16; 19:19-21).

See next pg.

Final statement for now

Off to work; but I wanted to conclude saying that when spiritual fruit isn't in church then we see an example or model at best of a worldly business structure; and at worse aren't discerning what needs to be done. There is more of course than financial matters here but it is a litmus test as it were. The most serious issue is when someone has discernment and basically is ignored as a lone voice or voices of reason; and that can extend to abuse issues or warnings of things to come which everyone should take heed to.

Proper support when things are done right of course is equally necessary; but again as stated before a lot of people just would rather give tithes and not be part of decision making when they can be and allow whatever happens as though it is in a vacuum.

That can also be the case with doctrinal issues or error creeping in; laypersons may see among them or others entering the flock danger signals which Pastors may either deliberately ignore or in the case of a church not already ascribing to error of some sort involving ego a Pastor often is too busy and we shouldn't expect them to be able to function in all capacities. Elders and deacons have responsibility to keep error out of the flock but often may not see it right away either. The proper fruit of the Spirit therefore is concerned with matters within a local congregation which individual manifestations should interact; rather than everyone caught up in their own experiences which without such interaction can become self serving or lead to unforeseen traps.

Prayer by laying on of hands today for spiritual gifts seems in my opinion to still be an option today; but of course warings come not to do this hastily as someone demon possessed or influenced may have a negative affect if a person is prayed for prematurely. Testing the spirits in general from what I see due to lack of spiritual giftings of discernment is an extremely serious situation today.

Gotta run. Agape.

RP

Conclusion on Corinthians

As stated in my response to Gigi (as usual ran out of room); I was talking about a church that was immature but still was a true church. Ignorance seemed to be the chief issue rather than not being God's children. This showed there was nothing wrong with true spiritual gifts but as Paul stated the most important thing was love and spiritual fruit in one's growth in the Lord.

Interaction in the church with gifts today is quite rare it seems; with people blabbing out in multitudes tongues with no interpreter; not discerning what spirit is controlling them; and with lack of wisdom as well whether in worldly or spiritual matters (as the spiritual should guide our worldly actions as we see in Proverbs) people are running amuck with their finances and hearts often far from where they should be. In general what happens is those who have genuine giftings are cast aside from the myriad and excessive number of teachers or self professed individuals who are pastors; so that those who are elders or deacons either are pushed aside as being less relevant or not able to utilize the God given authority for discipleship. That is especially true with warning a Pastor if error creeps in which thankfully many Reformed churches do accurately (although I don't agree with some ordinances but nonetheless I use it as an example here).

Of course the most obvious problems with the result in that situation is that someone who has true insight is often ignored when it comes to winning a popularity contest or majority concensus. In theory a church should basically be united but it is too easy to overemphasize those with worldly titles (especially when it comes to financial affairs) that skew towards a worldly dichotomy rather than sound fiscal wisdom that truly seeks wisdom from laypersons. Some of the time laypersons are at fault for not sounding the alarm or being more involved; tacitly accepting whatever is proposed or not attending these forums.

Thanks for your response and support as always.

I am; briefly going to summarize what I can discern in regard to the Holy Spirit and its characteristic "behavior" as it were; realizing that such a description is at best only a general statement related to part of the invisible Triune God.

The clear teaching in scripture is indeed; that upon confession of faith that comes with repentance the Spirit dwells with mankind.

I don't have time to get into the verses but in your case that isn't necessary-for others reading this I ask if unfamiliar look it up yourself. The sealing of the Spirit ( Ephesians 3 I believe) demonstrates how things differ from when the Spirit used to work in the Prophets of old; and we can see this with David's pleading with God not to take away His Spirit from him.

The fruit of the Spirit is the key to how God chooses to operate within the Body of Christ because even though it doesn't describe individual parts of the Body (as we see described in Corinthians) the idea is clear from those passages that actions should demonstrate Christ rather than a confused plethora of manifestations. Indeed in that case this WAS a church of believers. We see this from the greeting to the church; and from expectations to grow from milk to meat as it were and God's discipline even with death of some taking communion unworthily and other "in your face" behavior problems but nonetheless by and large this WAS a gathering of true believers or Paul's scolding demeanor would have been a waste of time. God disciplines His own.

Today of course we can see the most obvious departure from the truth with churches who are in general charismatic in that filthy lucre (See Peter) is rampant; hence showing the whole root is currupt and the fruit as well with people teaching deception and being decieved. Now the Corinthians were warned that potential existed to follow boisterous orators who were "kings" as it were but they never appeared to move that way.

Jn 1.1 " The Word"

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

We shall try to understand how the world was framed by the word of God. (Heb.11.3) Will of the Father is unseen. It is 'the bosom' in this verse,"No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him" When the Law states as to the quality of a fruit bearing tree the seed is the proof. The tree bearing fruits is the world made to appear. Let us apply this analogy to the triune God. The Word was God and the Son as the seed 'in the bosom' of the Word appears as the tree of life.

'the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.' Applying the analogy of the seed when made to appear is not seed but a tree. It is how the Word was with God. Power and Wisdom of God creats the worlds where natural world is made to appear and it brings forth thistles and thorns as well. Whereas the world where the seed producing a fruit bearing tree holds another quality. It is to which Apostle Peter refers,"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." This world abideth forever. This is where 'the God's rest' as the Son was in the bosom of his Father, and it is to which our faith shall carry.

Being born again refers to the power and wisdom of God so the seed is incorruptible, and what tree is become is called tree of righteousness. It is set about the tree of life.

There are trees in the natural world. When Jesus was made of woman he is called the branch. The word which was with God designates this part of humanity as 'only begotten Son' because he is the word become flesh."And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious." For Jews and the Gentiles alike this rest is glorious.

Hello,

God is One as He is the Word, In his Power and Wisdom we have two entities both work so there is order which is perfect. If Wisdom does not know where to stop what is the use. If it is all power without wisdom it is disaster. So when God maintains this order where both wisdom and power is unified there is glory.

God sent his Son who of His Father has become salvation.

In the Gospels he is man in all aspects, he felt hunger, felt thirst and when soldiers pierced his side while hanging on the cross he bled; He was a man except he did not sin and knew no sin. In his resurrection he proved he was God.

God sent his Word which we know as the Word which was with God; the word became flesh but we believe vy his death and resurrection thathe was indeed word becoome flesh.

While multiplying loaves and fishes, he insisted that the leftovers were gathered which was his admission where he came from.

I have been an architect and how my employess saw me was different from how my clients saw me. How I was seen at home by my family is different; for that matter how my dog saw me was altogether different. But I never felt different I knew there is only me.

With joy and peace in Him

Richard,

We are brethren in Christ, and that is what matters the most about how we relate to one another.

As to spiritual gifts, I believe that God can work in believers any way He wills, so I am not a cessationist. However, I do think that what many try to pass off as manifestations of the Holy Spirit are suspect. But I do know that there are times when God brings out in believers specific workings, whether a word of knowledge, discernment, God-given dreams or visions, deep moments of intercession with the Holy Spirit interceding in us, among other things. I have personally had such workings done within me at times.

In regards to eschatology, I believe that time will show us the truth but mostly, God, in His great love for us in Christ Jesus, will be faithful to us and will lead, equip, and bring us through any events that occur before Jesus' second coming unless God takes us home to Him in death prior to this glorious consummation of this age.

Be blessed, Richard, my friend.

Brothers Chris, Spencer, and sister Gigi,

I just wanted to say amen to what you have shared with Cordellwbeesr. I have nothing more to add. Thank you!

Blessings!

Hello Cordellwbeesr, just to share with you my understanding of the relationship between God the Father and Jesus His Son. And to state, this is one of those impossible 'concepts' to understand, simply because we can only (and rightly) read and understand such things based on our ability with human limitatons. Many have tried to illustrate this 'strange' relationship using earthly imagery, such as using the three aspects of the sun or an egg, but even these fail to correctly show us the Truth of divine things.

What Jesus Himself declared to us should be strongly regarded; verses such as John 16:27,28 (Jesus came out from God - out from God's Being); John 17:5 (Jesus had all of God's Glory from the beginning); and John 1:1-14 (God took His Word and gave it flesh; and this was for the purpose of God's Love being shown in offering the perfect & only Sacrifice that could atone for our sins). And there are many other Scriptures that others have given you, which should show us that this Jesus was not just an ordinary human being born with human parents in sin, but was indeed the "second man, the Lord from Heaven" ( 1 Corinthians 15:47) and also called the "last Adam, a quickening (life-giving) spirit" ( 1 Corinthians 15:45).

Yes, Jesus came forth from the Person of God and given flesh for the purpose of being the only Sacrifice that could redeem us back to God. So how does Jesus have "free will" or even "prays to God". Remember, God gave His Word to be made human, so as a Human, Jesus encountered everything we have to face in life, and as a Human, the Glory He had ( John 17:5) had to be laid aside so that He could be like us, suffer and die (for God cannot die); see Philippians 2:5-11 (He was God's equal, He emptied Himself (Gk. kenosis) & took on humanity. Jesus now became God's Son in His Humanity, so He had free will and as a Son prayed to His Father. How can God pray to God, is often asked? These verses quoted should help you in knowing this Truth. GBU.

It was largely triggered by the taking of Charlie Kirk's life yesterday causing great angst and frustration with my one friend in particular. It was certainly helpful if anything just thrusting us out like that.

I certainly appreciate your prayers; we are short staffed at work and it is annoying being nagged about catching up etc especially with multiple supervisors but I have gotten used to it I suppose.

This weekend my Aunt is planning to visit my dad probably around 10 or shortly thereafter (Eastern Standard time of course).

I haven't thought of any new things to say to him. BTW FINALLY there was approval for his insurance claim and backpay to MARCH of this year should be coming soon!

i am glad you are solid; whatever differences our eschatology are as it is a support in my behalf. I don't know what your views are on spiritual gifts and would suspect you are a cessationist. It is frustrating with things I know the Lord has shown me because with all these supposed revelations I feel I have to try to prove myself and of course can start doubting. I am certain about being able to discern good and evil in the spiritual realm as to whatever gifts He gives us are irrevocable ( Romans 11:29).

There is more I could say but again I am indebted to your prayer and steadfastness here as of late.

I'll talk to you again soon; Lord willing.

Agape; Rich P

Dear Cordellbeesr,

I will be praying for you that the Lord will open your mind and soul to understanding how Jesus is both human and God in one person.

Richard,

glad to here the good report! May the Lord make the event fruitful unto salvation of those whom interacted with you and your fellow workers.

I am keeping in prayer the things you request.

Thanks bro Lbooth1955 for sharing these important matters again. I have pored through these two recent posts of yours and in all honesty, I have to admit that I'm still confused (to my shame of course). You have taken great pains to explain all this, but I remain perplexed as to Israel's position before God today.

I can understand national Israel's position and the covenants and promises that they have been given and will be fulfilled, but unable to discern the state of those in Jewry who get saved, are born again by God's Spirit and living this new life in Christ: how do Scriptures such as Galatians 3:28,29 and Ephesians 2:11-15 fit concerning the saved from Israel? Are those promises & "future program" given to national Israel (that you highlighted) still applicable to saved Israel? If so, it seems to me that God has two programs for those being saved today: one for saved Israel and one for the Church (of the Gentiles). Therefore, Israel should not be considered part of Christ's Body, which is the present reality for those in Christ from the Gentiles, and therefore "being one in Christ" takes on a different meaning for all who are born again.

Or else, your distinction is that national Israel will see those covenants/promises fulfilled at the Millennium when they realize the Messiah Who came for them was the One Whom they pierced; but the saved of Israel are part of Christ's Body, the Church, as together we share in present blessings, being caught away when Jesus appears, and no longer being distinguishable as Jew and Gentile, rather as one together in Christ.

However, maybe neither of these two options is quite what you believe and there is a third option or a redefining of the other options. Would appreciate your clarification on this, so that in your future posts on this subject, I will know how you understand the relationship of Israel (both saved & unsaved) and the Church. Blessings.

Amen Lbooth1955.

Thank you and your fellowship is very welcome.

God bless you and all that you do.

A good report today-I went out for a little over an hour to a local event and probably a couple hundred tracts were passed out; although a few got multiple ones. There is another local event where a lot of students were receptive that they were advertising that we may attend early next month. I won't get into specifics as I am glad for the success and wouldn't want anything getting out that could ruin things. I just thought I should mention that people still at least are willing to take tracts; although not much scriptural conversation came up other than a couple Jewish folks who weren't open at this point to our message.

Thanks for those who have been praying for me. Hope this encourages others while it is yet day to do the same. Always pray before going out.

Agape.

Amen brother jesse!!

a very clear picture can be drawn out of those scriptures!

God said he will not give his glory to another here in Isaiah 42:8

"I am the lord: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.

However Immanuel! came out of the bosom of the Father and was manifested in the flesh!!

Matthew 1:23.

John 1:18.

1 Timothy 3:16.

He shared that Glory!

John 17:5 "and now, o father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Undeniably God!!

Blessings!

Thanks still trying to get an understanding

Thanks for your response great scriptures but how can I as a Christian say that Jesus is God with no separation? Every thing that has been presented to me keep showing that Jesus had free will because of his human state he has the spirit of God in him. Also when Jesus prayed and went to pray he was praying to God can someone explain if we say Jesus is God then who is he praying to? I am really caught up in the understanding

The Father is not the Son nor the Son the Holy Sprit etc .etc

But they are One .

No man knows the Father save the Son nor the Son save the Father .

No man comes unto the zFather save by the Son.

When we think to meditate on the Trinity of God we are to all intents and purposes entering into the Holy of Holies for we are thinking on the God head .

To think that an unregenerate man can understand in an measure is to think you can enter the Holy of Holies .

A person who is not BORN again is not even in the camp so to speak . That camp of over 2000,000 people surrounded the tabernacle how does anyone think thr6 will get even close?

But a carnally minded Christian ( see 1Cor) cannot either for while they are ' in the camp' they " cannot receive the things of God " It's like trying to do algebra or advanced mathematics before learning your + - and division so to speak.

This is not to avoid the subject but rather not to waste time on " vain debates" with people who have little or nomspuritual understanding or foundation to go " a little further" .

The approach into the Holy of Holies was very clear and while it is true in Christ we may now " boldly enter " it that does not mean foolishly moreover not without blood .

A person who does mot even accept the all sufficient sacrifice of Christ cannot go any further then on pain of death .Now committing the sin of presumption .

John 17 records the Lord's Prayer that the church might be one even as the Father and Son were one .

I think that we only enter they very Hoy place as One . One body one faith etc . " Our Father .."

Unto the blood that speaks of better things than the blood of Abel " I think also very few do enter though all,who believe can .

But rather stay in the outer court where things are 'seen' with the naked eye . Rather than by the Word and Spirit of God .

Yet the pattern of the curtain into the outer court is it not the same as that of the Holy place? And have we not been made priests ."?

It is impossible that Jesus was tempted with every temptation known to man . The scriptures state he " was tempted in all points.." What points? The points of the compass so to speak . The that of the flesh the eye the mind and the pride of life .

ALL temptations of whatever sort they are are designed to get us to act in the flesh and not the Spirit.

When the Lord told his disciples to " watch and pray lest you fall into temptation " for the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak . But they fell asleep but he stayed awake and in doing so overcame the temptation and weakness of the flesh . For he was dying in gethsemane under the tremendous weight of the worlds sin and powers of darkness seeking his destruction . Sweating blood is a sign of imminent death . Hence His prayer " with strong tears and crying" said Peter for the cup of death to pass from Him. For He knew full well he was the Passover lamb the " Lamb of God that taketh away the sin of the world " and to fulfil all scripture he needs must die tomorrow on Golgotha tree . He was not trying to avoid the cross but His supreme objective was to fulfil the Will of God the Father thus he prayed . Not my will but thine be done . When we pray for sanctification we are praying to the known will of God . We cannot sanctify ourselves but in so praying we are conforming to the will of God who then sanctifies us . Is it not written " He that sanctifieth and he that is sanctified are one"? For in truth what He was about to suffer he could not as " The Man Christ Jesus nor by his own will endure what had to be endured . But he was crucified not by his own will but the Fathers for " it pleased God to bruise Him" and the cry " My God my God why hast thou forsaken me?" Was the the Man both conforming to the scriptures and in perfect harmony with them( Psalms) and the mind of the Man unable to comprehend the incomprehensible on every level . But the battle has been won in the garden and every stripe brought healing etc.

To all that be in Christ,

1. Identity: Who We Are

Body of Christ, not Israel

Believers today are part of the "one new man" ( Eph. 2:15), a spiritual organism distinct from Israel.

There is "neither Jew nor Greek" in Christ ( Gal. 3:28).

Romans 9:4 shows that the covenants belonged to Israel-not the Gentiles.

2. Promises: What We Possess

Israel's Covenants

Abrahamic: land and nation ( Gen. 17:7-8).

Mosaic: law and priesthood ( Ex. 19:5-6).

Davidic: kingdom and throne ( 2 Sam. 7:12-16).

New Covenant ( Jer. 31:31-34) promised to Israel.

Body of Christ's Blessings

We were once "strangers from the covenants" ( Eph. 2:12).

Now we are blessed with "all spiritual blessings in heavenly places" ( Eph. 1:3).

Our position is in Christ, not in Israel's covenant structure.

3. Destiny: Where We Are Headed

Israel's Future

Earthly kingdom promises remain for Israel ( Jer. 23:5-6; Matt. 19:28).

Romans 11:25-29 confirms God will fulfill His covenants with them.

Church's Future

Our hope is heavenly, as citizens of heaven ( Phil. 3:20-21).

The mystery revealed to Paul shows the Church is a distinct entity ( Col. 1:25-27).

The Body of Christ will be caught up to meet the Lord ( 1 Thess. 4:16-17).

Summary

Christians in this dispensation are not "spiritual Israel." The covenants remain with Israel, while the Church enjoys a new, heavenly calling through the mystery revealed to Paul. To merge them erases God's faithfulness to Israel and diminishes the uniqueness of the Body of Christ.

Grace and Peace

To all that be in Christ,

Who we are in the Body of Christ.

In this present dispensation of grace, the believer in Christ is part of the Body of Christ, not "spiritual Israel." Scripture makes a clear distinction between God's covenant promises to Israel and the mystery revealed to Paul for the Church. Israel was given covenants tied to land, law, kingdom, and priesthood ( Gen. 17:7-8; Exod. 19:5-6; Jer. 31:31-34). These covenants are never transferred to Gentiles or to the Body of Christ. Instead, Paul says believers today are made "fellowheirs" in a new, unprophesied program ( Eph. 3:1-6), not inheritors of Israel's covenants.

Romans 9:4 states that the covenants "pertain" to Israel, not to the Gentiles. Paul confirms this distinction in Ephesians 2:11-12: before Christ, Gentiles were "aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise." Now, in Christ, we are "made nigh by the blood of Christ" (v. 13), but not by becoming Israel. Instead, Jew and Gentile are joined into "one new man" (v. 15), the Body of Christ, which is distinct from Israel's prophetic promises.

The Body of Christ's blessings are spiritual, located "in heavenly places in Christ" ( Eph. 1:3), not earthly as Israel's kingdom promises ( Jer. 23:5-6; Matt. 19:28). Paul stresses in Galatians 3:28 that in this dispensation "there is neither Jew nor Greek," showing the old covenantal distinctions are set aside in Christ.

Israel's promises of land and kingdom remain future ( Rom. 11:25-29). God has not abandoned Israel but postponed their program until the fullness of the Gentiles is come in. The Church today is not Israel redefined, but a distinct entity created by the revelation of the mystery ( Col. 1:25-27). To merge the two erases God's faithfulness to His covenants with Israel and diminishes the uniqueness of the Body of Christ's calling.

Grace and Peace.

Spencer,

Well spoken, and yes I noticed that you were likely to be a dispensationalist.

I appreciate and welcome your responses.

Grace and Peace.

Correction:

In the first para please read,"So the compound number (3x12) is according to the word of God."

as

"So the compound number (3x4=12) is according to the word of God."

Nations founded on lie cannot stand; There are only two nations which is how God shall establish his kingdom of light. The other kingdom as with Babylon the great we shall see: Mystery of the great whore is revealed when the stone is cast down.(Rev.18.21) Meanwhile tet us feed the flock as instructed by our Lord Saviour.

2 Cor.3.18 "Through a glass clearly"

"But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord."

God fashioned all hearts alike so an open face in terms of the gospel of God is truth. God sent his only begotten Son whose death and resurrection render the gospel of God is same as the gospel of Christ. What are the doctrines of man? They are the heresies 'by the sleight of ; Jude 1.12men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive' and Jude refers to them as spots in your charity, (Eph.4.14) and we have in this forum as well, dispensationalism they call it, playing on one single string and it is adnauseam,'clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots." We are to grow in knowledge so what is cast on the face of Jesus Christ is the image we are looking at.(2 Cor.4.6) What these sects do. James tell it to our profit."But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed."(Jas.1.25;Jn.3.21) Their 'works' are open or done under the light. "But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God." Our works are done in God so entering into the God's rest our fruits shall never prove to be duds. The firmament sheweth the handiwork of God. Heaven where we have the building of God not made with hands serves as a glass. Proof it is in the wall of the city of God,"And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel."These 12 foundations bearing the names of the apostles, are studded with stones. So the breast plate of Aaron is pointing to the 'new' Jerusalem, four square, which is above the mid-air!